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You really can't argue against or for the use of slurs unless you're a person affected by them.

The reason Kieran's thread crashed and burned the way it did is because he (if memory serves) more or less gave everyone free reign to use words like slurs and whatnot under the guise of free speech, which is like, no???? Freedom does not abide attacking the freedom of others, which is what non-reclaimed slurs do, no matter which way you slice it.

Back to the discussion at hand, there's a massive difference between saying "faggot" to mean a bundle of sticks and "trap" to mean a sort of trick, to well...

Stuff like the N word are a complete no-no.
Black people can say the n word, gay people can say faggot, lesbians can say d*ke to refer to people of their group in a friendly matter, because they're -reclaiming- it. They can reappropriate a word to "take away its power", so to speak.

Some minorities would rather not use slurs at all, feeling attacked by them.

People not affected by the slurs have no place reclaiming the slurs because they were never used to oppress them.

Like I can say faggot, fag, all I want. My trans women friends and most of my male queer friends would rather not use it or be called that, I comply. A straight, cis ("not trans" basically) person for instance, cannot as such a word was never used against them to beat them down.

A white person cannot say n***a, as that word was never used as a way to undermine them.

As for joking about white people, white people have long been the majority, first class citizens for decades now. A little joke about how they don't put spices in food isn't going to cause the slavery of white men.

I'm white. I think that shit's a funny little goof, no one ever means it in a rude way either outside of like punching up.

Satire =/= Oppression. This also applies to making what amounts to little more than jokes upkeeping racial, sexual and gender stereotypes.

"There are two kinds of humor. One kind that makes us chuckle about our foibles and our shared humanity -- like what Garrison Keillor does. The other kind holds people up to public contempt and ridicule -- that's what I do. Satire is traditionally the weapon of the powerless against the powerful. I only aim at the powerful. When satire is aimed at the powerless, it is not only cruel -- it's vulgar." - Molly Ivins, People magazine, 1991

Furthermore, saying stuff like "Words don't really matter in my country" is kind of... Disrespecting the amount of people who feel personally attacked by such words, and also a complete lie.

Originally posted by Some guy from resetera
Originally posted by Some other guy from resetera
It's not like that.
I'm French and here, we don't care as much about the meaning of some words. It's much more of an american thing.
I understand that saying the N-word isn't something to do and I wouldn't do it.
But also, It's such a cultural thing that it's hard for me to actually understand why a certain word could mean so much to people.

I don't know if I worded that correctly or not.

Listen buddy, I’m Italian but I also speak French and Spanish and I’ve lived all over EU. So you’d go up to fellow french POCs and calle them “négros”? Because you guys “don’t care about the meaning of words”?
Bull-fuckin-shit.
There was fucking mayhem all over the Country when JP Gourlain said “working like a nègre” on TV and that is much more tame than négro (nigger)... anti-racism protests, boycottin JPG products and shops forced to be closed... but yeah, you never noticed anything because French people just don’t care.

yes i realize how embarrassing it is to quote neogaf 2 neogaf harder but this is a good rebuttal i feel

Racism exists everywhere, just because you're not affected by it, doesn't mean others are.
Stuff like "weón" was also never really used to oppress minorities, its really just a general term like "dumbass" or "dude".

Slurs are on a complete other level compared to, say, "stupid asshat".

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Also hi its me lion, kinda moved on from romhacking to drawing over the past few weeks because of loss of interest and disillusion with the community and also i really want to draw boyfriends???
Ban me if you want, you probably will and I dont blame you, I shouldn't rereg, I just wanted to make this post

If I attacked or subtweeted anyone, I'm sorry. I'm actually trying to not do that because that was my fucking brand back when I actually had an account (#FreeLion (jk dont)) and I want to actually sound like a sane person instead of being constantly Mad Online. Disclaimer, the "weón" tangent is not an attempt to shit on the people who discussed it.

It's a lot easier to practice than ASM ever was, but it's just as easy to get the hang of!
I wouldn't mind touching 65c816 ASM again tho for like shitty homebrew experiments or something lol

Hacking Mario just doesnt interest me anymore, I'm sorry.
My love for VIP5 is eternal however and I'll be there to be Eye O' Mine, Maks and Ryrir's moral reinforcement when dismantling and fixing that thing's ASM for the eventual translation. Someone should really put the VIP fixes and translations in the hack section already, its not like anyone from 2ch is gonna come in here and ask for them to be taken down lol

Decoy add me on Discord you fuck >:((((((

Play Breath of Fire 1-3, FFX International, Arc the Lad 1&2 and Wild Arms 1 (and Star Ocean 1 if you're willing to put up with Rushed Game Design and Superfluous Mechanics)

Wishing all y'all in SMW hacking the best in the future both in and outside the site.
Huge apologies for being a massive pain in the ass in the past, I was in a really awful place of mind (not an excuse).
I hope more people manage to complete more "out there" hacks and experiment more with making their own resources to go along with things others made or stuff from other games (both to give their hacks some flair and to contribute to the site).

l8r sk8rs

~eternally following carol's twitter~

P.S. May Kaizo Light's hold over the hack section never end =)
THIS POST PAYED FOR THE TOSH X SHU IS TOTALLY CANON BABEYYYYYY GANG
lion who tf let you into this site once again and add such an elaborate post in an unbelievably short time after the registration?!
I have a Discord server as well! (by joining, you agree to the rules)
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Basically, I believe in peace and bashing two bricks together.

I'm going to go with my logical side and believe that he wrote that in a word document or something before hand and then pasted it in once he made an account rather than type it within smwcentral that quickly like some kind of super human.

And yet, and I am willing to be imaginative...
                                                                                                                  
                              
Originally posted by MercuryPenny
i'm of the opinion that everyone, on some level, deserves to be made fun of. learning to take a joke at your expense is a basic part of human interaction.

i don't consider it in the staff's jurisdiction to decide what topics are suitable for comedy. if someone is genuinely offended by a joke, they can express it and the userbase at large can threaten to ostracize them if deemed necessary. if they concede and agree not to revisit the subject, then nothing of value is lost and life can go on for all parties involved. if they become hostile and start to be toxic, then you have proper grounds for a ban or harsh reprimand from the staff. if they just leave, then...well, they probably would have left if they were banned for it.

I also agree with this post.
Windowless ride, feeling alive
Are you alive or just breathing?
Casual reminder that re-registering to bypass a ban is still against the rules, as well as posting on behalf of a banned user.

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10. Do not post, relay messages or submit content on behalf of banned users. Doing so bypasses the restrictions given to them, defeating the purpose of their ban.


We're aware this is a controversial topic of conversation, but this doesn't mean that you can subvert the rules to participate in it. Further posts of this nature will be deleted on sight.
Originally posted by MarioFanGamer
America, for example, is quite strict about swearing

w
maybe on tv or something. if you walk outside youll hear a bunch

Originally posted by Bobby Zampar
You know, SMW have limitations due of the SNES and 16-bits, but could it be possible for anyone to break these limits? Surprassing our expectations?

S-CPU <-> S-PPU interactions (and the S-PPU in general) are the ultimate limitation facing anything you want to do with the snes. you can pipe music through the cartridge audio pin, stream sfx via hdma, bankswitch between a billion rom chips for tons of gfx and shit, run the game engine on 5GHz external processors, but at one point youre gonna have to interface with the PPU, because thats the only way you can display anything onscreen, and the only way you can do that is via the snes cpu, and the only time you can do it is the vertical (or horizontal) blanking period
Though I'm mostly fine with how things are right now (more so than many others), I do believe the "Culture and Censorship" thing needs to be a future topic. If there are a decent amount of people that are unhappy then there needs to be a discussion so everyone can reach a common ground. The discussion last time was left unfinished, and multiple loose ends were left.

Ultimately, this stems from the fact that SMWCentral houses both a community of people with similar interests and behaviour, and also a resource of SMW Hacking, instead of one or the other. I could go on about this for paragraphs but I'd rather wait for a more appropriate thread to be made.

I'm not sure a decision can be made without alienating either half of the community, but I'd like to see another attempt at least.

Originally posted by Shiny Ninetales
Totally understandable, but considering that the main tools and resources (example: big patches like SA-1) were updated almost instantly after LM3.00 was released minimizes a bit the point and the fact that idol indirectly blamed Vitor about the incompatibilities, which led it to cancel BLDC, thing that is totally off in my point of view (not so much the cancelling but the blame, even more considering that the same people behind LM3.00 were the ones who updated most of the resources).

The news post is mostly informative and it refers to LM3 as a great update multiple times, it just brings up the point that "hey sorry some of the other tools hosted on the site might break on it so be careful". And the post you referred to was posted a singular day after Lunar Magic 3.00 was released. Unless you mean to say that all tools were updated the same day as LM?

And "blame" is also a bit too much for this situation, all she said was "Vitor didn't communicate this with us", which he didn't, but nothing like "the reason BLDC didn't happen was because of Vitor", instead it was more like "yeah we were caught by surprise too and we'll have to re-work a few things sorry".
BLDC isn't cancelled either, it's simply been shifted back likely to summer and we're in the middle of quickly putting together another contest designed to take advantage of tall horizontal levels and other LM3 functions to fill the planned January timeslot.
Originally posted by RanAS
And "blame" is also a bit too much for this situation, all she said was "Vitor didn't communicate this with us", which he didn't, but nothing like "the reason BLDC didn't happen was because of Vitor", instead it was more like "yeah we were caught by surprise too and we'll have to re-work a few things sorry".

I guess that could enter in the things Veck said could have been worded better, but yeah I'm not saying it is really a blame, but can be interpreted like that, considering for example, several people besides Vitor was involved into LM3.00 and none of them said nothing (speaking of bad worded things, I should have clarified better this in my post, sorry for the missunderstanding).

Originally posted by RanAS
And the post you referred to was posted a singular day after Lunar Magic 3.00 was released. Unless you mean to say that all tools were updated the same day as LM?

I mean, yes, they were (PIXI, GPS, SA-1 and several patches). And really the incompatible resources were a minority (for the instance, the change to LM1.8 was definitely worse in that aspect), and most of them are compatible now.

With this last sentece said, I wanna ask: does it really take too much time to organize such a contest as BLDC? Because if it's due to resources and incompatibilities I think it's still viable for this month, unless there is another reason for that, which by the way I'm sure it is that you're letting people experiment with LM3.00 before making such a big contest (or that's why I can conclude with FPzero's post).
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2021 TRENO vibe check thread
Originally posted by RanAS
The news post is mostly informative and it refers to LM3 as a great update multiple times, it just brings up the point that "hey sorry some of the other tools hosted on the site might break on it so be careful".


This needs to be clarified.

The news post doesn't say that these things *might* be incompatible, it (and the accompanying Discord announcement) flat out says that they are:

Originally posted by news post
As wonderful of a Christmas gift as it was, Lunar Magic 3.00 introduced powerful new features (bigger levels and multiple exits for just a start) that have resulted in a whole bunch of incompatibilities with various resources across the site. These mainly affect the tools (GIEPY for example is currently incompatible), and a possibly huge number of patches.
Originally posted by Discord announcement
the advent of Lunar Magic 3.00 has introduced a slew of incompatibilities with various resources across the site, primarily in our patch and tool section (GIEPY, for example, is incompatible).


There's no possible way that we could have known that *so many* resources were incompatible, let alone anything at all, because we were just as surprised by the release as everyone else. These are wrong, and I apologize. Everything should have said that we didn't know what was compatible or not.

It's been said that Vitor made sure to avoid incompatibilities as much as possible, and he certainly did a good job of it: the thread set up to report incompatibilities has turned up almost nothing. But it's not enough for only one side to check. This is the issue we had with the LM 3.00 launch. It was a big update, and it absolutely had the potential to make many resources incompatible. It's the ASM team's job to enforce compatibility with the latest Lunar Magic, so they at the very least should have been aware of such a big update so they can recheck things for compatibility. This is something they had/have to do anyway following its release, so there was no reason to hold this back other than to maintain the surprise factor, which is quite frankly a very poor reason.

I don't think it's a stretch to say the courtesy should have been extended to the staff team that "hey, we're putting up the biggest update to Lunar Magic since 2010 on Christmas, care to test some major resources to confirm they're still compatible?"

(For the record, a few staff members have said they were made aware of its release ahead of time, but they were asked to stay silent.)



Originally posted by Shiny Ninetales
With this last sentece said, I wanna ask: does it really take too much time to organize such a contest as BLDC? Because if it's due to resources and incompatibilities I think it's still viable for this month, unless there is another reason for that, which by the way I'm sure it is that you're letting people experiment with LM3.00 before making such a big contest (or that's why I can conclude with FPzero's post).


You hit the nail on the head. The reason BLDC has been pushed back this time is not because of logistical issues, but because after LM 3.00's release we want to host a contest that places focus on Lunar Magic and its new features, and BLDC doesn't do that.
Originally posted by Noivern
so there was no reason to hold this back other than to maintain the surprise factor, which is quite frankly a very poor reason.

Ultimately, this is not for you to decide. Nobody here is under any obligation to report anything to SMWCentral or its team. It is their work and they alone get to decide when to release it and under what circumstances. Quite a few people knew that this was coming, but kept silent out of respect. Respect that some people here are clearly still lacking. This is exactly the reason why some people who feel like they should have been informed, were not informed.

Releases like these don't come around often and SMWCentral should embrace them as a chance for celebration. This is an update hundreds of users have wanted for years. Instead, we get a lukewarm response spearheaded by "we, the staff" posting passive-aggressive news and discord posts. Grotesque claims about "many things not being compatible" are made without first checking anything. If this is the way you work, I am not surprised nobody bothered to tell you anything.

Imagine being an outsider coming onto the site for the first time and reading a news post. Surely you can see that a positive news post outlining the new possibilities would be a much better welcome than a news post outlining all the problems it may or may not bring. This is just an example, but in general, I would advise the site to be more positive in its outings.

Originally posted by Noivern
I don't think it's a stretch to say the courtesy should have been extended to the staff team

I think a big problem with SMWCentral is its sense of entitlement. I respect the staff and that they use their free time for all of us. Mario hacking would not be the same without their efforts. However, the site is in service of its users, and not the other way around. I don't think working on the site as a staff member should give you any more rights than a normal user.
Originally posted by Ragey
Releases like these don't come around often and SMWCentral should embrace them as a chance for celebration. This is an update hundreds of users have wanted for years. Instead, we get a lukewarm response spearheaded by "we, the staff" posting passive-aggressive news and discord posts. Grotesque claims about "many things not being compatible" are made without first checking anything. If this is the way you work, I am not surprised nobody bothered to tell you anything.

You have a good point. I'm a bit iffy on that aggressive tone as well, and that coming from someone who was staff before, but I'm almost sure that wasn't intentional, especially the "we, the staff" part. It slipped under the radar.
If I were a newcomer I'd expect the news posts to be polite and enticing, which was something I recall addressing back then, and the new LM update shouldn't be any different. It should apply for everything.

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I think a big problem with SMWCentral is its sense of entitlement. I respect the staff and that they use their free time for all of us. Mario hacking would not be the same without their efforts. However, the site is in service of its users, and not the other way around. I don't think working on the site as a staff member should give you any more rights than a normal user.

Agreed.
Windowless ride, feeling alive
Are you alive or just breathing?
I don't like disallowing only certain people from using some stupid words. Everyone should follow the same rules for what they can and can't mention. With that said, ni
QQ
a.



Originally posted by Ragey
Ultimately, this is not for you to decide. Nobody here is under any obligation to report anything to SMWCentral or its team. It is their work and they alone get to decide when to release it and under what circumstances. Quite a few people knew that this was coming, but kept silent out of respect. Respect that some people here are clearly still lacking. This is exactly the reason why some people who feel like they should have been informed, were not informed.
I agree. Same with asking FuSoYa to release LM's source code, because open-source or whatever. FuSoYa currently doesn't want to do that, it's their decision and I respect that. Complaining about their decision on their program won't solve much. It's their program, they do what they want with it.
If you want an open-source program to edit MarioWorld levels so much, why don't you make it yourself?

Originally posted by Ragey
I think a big problem with SMWCentral is its sense of entitlement. I respect the staff and that they use their free time for all of us. Mario hacking would not be the same without their efforts. However, the site is in service of its users, and not the other way around. I don't think working on the site as a staff member should give you any more rights than a normal user.
I think the same. I like the staff and I think the site wouldn't be the same without them, but... I'm not sure if being staff member of some site should give you the right to know that some tool releases and when. That's for the author to decide if they want to make it known in advance or not.
I'd still abuse my powers if I was staff member. ops, i didn't say that, pls don't take that in account if you make me staff some day.


If you guys don't like that LM3.xx makes incompatibilities with other tools or some other problem, why don't you disallow usage of it in that contest or whatever, and only allow of 2.xx or even 1.xx. I don't know why it would be so difficult to do that, knowing that the 2.xx versions are still available in the tools section in some way. I know, using 2.xx would make the features of 3.xx unavailable, but wouldn't it be the same if 3.00 released at a date within the contest's timeline?
Personally, I've not used LM past 1.65 (last time I did was around 5 years ago) and I don't really take part in the contests, so I don't think my opinion holds much here, but I wanted to express my thoughts on the matter too.

This is the first time that I know in which I address a serious topic, so I'm sorry if I didn't do it well or my points were bad.
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C'mon, man, I try my best.
これは「なにか」ですわ
SAN値!ピンチ!
Originally posted by Ragey
Originally posted by Noivern
so there was no reason to hold this back other than to maintain the surprise factor, which is quite frankly a very poor reason.

Ultimately, this is not for you to decide. Nobody here is under any obligation to report anything to SMWCentral or its team. It is their work and they alone get to decide when to release it and under what circumstances. Quite a few people knew that this was coming, but kept silent out of respect. Respect that some people here are clearly still lacking. This is exactly the reason why some people who feel like they should have been informed, were not informed.

Releases like these don't come around often and SMWCentral should embrace them as a chance for celebration. This is an update hundreds of users have wanted for years. Instead, we get a lukewarm response spearheaded by "we, the staff" posting passive-aggressive news and discord posts. Grotesque claims about "many things not being compatible" are made without first checking anything. If this is the way you work, I am not surprised nobody bothered to tell you anything.

Imagine being an outsider coming onto the site for the first time and reading a news post. Surely you can see that a positive news post outlining the new possibilities would be a much better welcome than a news post outlining all the problems it may or may not bring. This is just an example, but in general, I would advise the site to be more positive in its outings.


I suppose you have a good point. You're not wrong about the slightly passive-aggressive nature of the news post. When I saw 3.0's features for the first time my eyes widened, much like many other people's reactions I'm sure. I messaged my friends, I posted images of it to people who only tangentially know about SMW hacking because they know me, I showed one of my real life friends who came by to visit because he knows about this old hobby of mine. I was excited, plain and simple. This excitement should have been better reflected in our news posts on the topic but it wasn't.

You're right that we don't really have the right to ask people for a heads-up on their projects. If they choose to let us know ahead of time that's great. Our tepid response was a reflection of some internal feelings on the matter, but those feelings should never have been made public especially at a time like 3.0's release. In reflecting on the news posts it's clear we shouldn't have mentioned the piece about the heads-up, and not made such large assumptions that so many things would break. That assumption was based on remembered knowledge of how previous big updates to LM in the past resulted in incompatibilities with our tools, so we assumed the same could happen here. As it turns out, we didn't have as much to fear as we did. I still think the incompatibilities thread was a good one to make because there were so many potential sources of compatibility problems that we just wouldn't have been able to easily check all on our own. The ASM team was already in the middle of a remoderation to begin with, as well as regular moderation and other planning projects so letting users tell us about incompatibilities they found was the right way to go.

I could sit here and make excuses about how it was Christmas and we weren't really around to properly check news posts for proper tone and things like that but I won't sugarcoat it. I'd consider this a failure of site PR to properly handle the situation we found ourselves in, and as PR Team Manager I take full responsibility for this. I'd like to assure you that we will continue to improve ourselves and the way we present announcements and news in the future.
So... I have a question... I'm going to be starting a brand new hack soon and will therefore have my first exposure to lm 3.0... am I going to have to dump all of the tools I've been using up to this point?

Or am I just going to need to spend a bunch of time scrolling through the incompatibilities thread to find what will and won't work?
                                                                                                                  
                              
Even if I haven't tried this out, I think that any tool you've used (except GIEPY) will work with LM3 fine. If it didn't help, sorry.
I have a Discord server as well! (by joining, you agree to the rules)
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Basically, I believe in peace and bashing two bricks together.

Originally posted by WhiteYoshiEgg
As far as I know, Vitor specifically coded new level size system to be as non-disruptive as possible. Apart from a handful of cases (sprite inserters and the horizontal scroll fix patch are the ones I know of), you can assume pre-3.0 resources to still work.



 
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wow this man has a point of view that differs from mine I better call him an incel amirite xD

if the shoe fits
Originally posted by Wavee
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wow this man has a point of view that differs from mine I better call him an incel amirite xD

if the shoe fits

Why did you even bump that conversation? You're just being toxic.
                                                                                                                  
                              
yeah that was dealt with ages ago. that accomplished nothing.
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