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Tip: Don't remake levels from other Mario games, especially popular ones (SMB1/3 1-1, for example).
[Complete] 021 - Gunky Grotto - JDC
Forum Index - Events - SMW Central Production 2 - World 4 - [Complete] 021 - Gunky Grotto - JDC
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@JDC, the BG looks better now though I'm not sure I'd put green rocks in there. Maybe grey instead for those. Anyways you need to grab a copy of the Disassembly of Sprite C6 and then change two lines of code at the very beginning. Change:

Code
BGColorLo: db $10,$8C BGColorHi: db $42,$31


To the following:

Code
BGColorLo: db $9C,$FF BGColorHi: db $F3,$FF


That should get the desired result.

@Daizo, there's not much in this level to say negative or positive about. The pokeys are stacked in a way that it could be difficult at this point to go over them. Other than the Pokeys it'd be nice to see something else enemies wise and tar wise.
Originally posted by cstutor89
@Daizo, there's not much in this level to say negative or positive about. The pokeys are stacked in a way that it could be difficult at this point to go over them. Other than the Pokeys it'd be nice to see something else enemies wise and tar wise.


Thanks, and yes, the pokeys are only in 3's if you don't have yoshi, if you do have yoshi, you can just eat them.
Oh I've forgot about the level like a idiot, hahaha XD

^Nah, of course I didn't, I was more busier sadly due to school and other things.

But yeah, I've gotten some progress.
Link because its too large.

Criticism is aloud, go for it #w{=)}
Based on what is in the screenshot only, I don't know what to say about it. I really have 2 problems with this level, (1) the amount of progress made in a week considering the deadline of which these levels are to be done and (2) the enemy choices and placements.

As far as (1) goes, I understand that life gets busy at times. But, considering that this level has had almost 3 months to be worked on and little progress was made between this week and last week, I'm going to say it again that you need to pick up the pace. At the rate of which this level is going and as well as others too, it's not going to be done by the end of the month.

But this part is really what's important. As far as (2) is concerned, the enemy choices and placements are biased against Big Mario, particularly in Screens 1 and 3. Screen 1 only gives 1 square of room with Mario to actually go around these two pokeys. It makes it very difficult for Big Mario to get through without taking a hit. There's a potential issue with Screen 2 if Mario comes from the top and there's a delay with falling in the line of fire with a Koopa kicking a Shell. Again for screen 3, same issue as Screen 1 except this time Mario is blocked with a slow-moving Pokey with a wall of sand coming moderately fast at you. Screen 4 is just unfair at this point. Bouncing Goomba in a road where I have to take the high road in a moderate speed level room is not very fun. I think you've swung the pendulum from being too easy with enemies unable to hit Mario to being too hard and unfair with enemies blocking Mario's way. The colors of the coins look a bit off considering how dark the level is and there isn't any power-up in this area either.

I guess the good thing is the land formation isn't flat and boring but other than what was presented from last week with just a screenshot I can't really say anything else positive about it.
Originally posted by cstutor89
Based on what is in the screenshot only, I don't know what to say about it. I really have 2 problems with this level, (1) the amount of progress made in a week considering the deadline of which these levels are to be done and (2) the enemy choices and placements.

As far as (1) goes, I understand that life gets busy at times. But, considering that this level has had almost 3 months to be worked on and little progress was made between this week and last week, I'm going to say it again that you need to pick up the pace. At the rate of which this level is going and as well as others too, it's not going to be done by the end of the month.

But this part is really what's important. As far as (2) is concerned, the enemy choices and placements are biased against Big Mario, particularly in Screens 1 and 3. Screen 1 only gives 1 square of room with Mario to actually go around these two pokeys. It makes it very difficult for Big Mario to get through without taking a hit. There's a potential issue with Screen 2 if Mario comes from the top and there's a delay with falling in the line of fire with a Koopa kicking a Shell. Again for screen 3, same issue as Screen 1 except this time Mario is blocked with a slow-moving Pokey with a wall of sand coming moderately fast at you. Screen 4 is just unfair at this point. Bouncing Goomba in a road where I have to take the high road in a moderate speed level room is not very fun. I think you've swung the pendulum from being too easy with enemies unable to hit Mario to being too hard and unfair with enemies blocking Mario's way. The colors of the coins look a bit off considering how dark the level is and there isn't any power-up in this area either.

I guess the good thing is the land formation isn't flat and boring but other than what was presented from last week with just a screenshot I can't really say anything else positive about it.


I apologise for lack of progress on my end but please do understand I'm very busy with life nowadays. More often than not, I usually don't touch Lunar Magic until the weekend or Friday.
So...:
-School from 9:00 to 15:10
-I stay behind till about 16:00 most days except Friday.
-I get in my house about 16:30
-Homework till about 17:00
-Eat.
-I get on the computer (properly) at around 17:30-18:00
-Not accounting for the fact I need to relax
-I have my own forum and collab to maintain as well.
-What time do I have left? Not much. You can't really blame me for only working on the weekends. :/

To be honest, I do understand SMWCP2's need to 'rush' I guess, as we are very close to completion. However, please do understand I have a life also, and a very busy one at that.
Progress should arrive soon. I'll work on it a bit more today.
Well at least your not me, at least you don't go on month long hiatuses and then have nothing to show by that time. But that's another story. . .

As for your part DiddyKaizo, it looks, okay. I can't say anything that cstutor hasn't already said. But at the same time, I can't say much at all in the first place because there isn't too much there. I would like to see at least 6 screens before I really go into an in-depth critique.

I'm not really caught up with this level either, I don't know if this is a second section of the level you are just starting or you've decided to completely scratch the original idea and start again with this, so I don't want to say anything major yet to avoid false claims.
Last edited on 2012-03-11 01:50:46 PM by Kojeco2.
Might as well:

Link because (once again) too large

I'll send an IPS when its more fixed.
May I say something?

This level reminds me so much of that first cave level in SMW; I don't know why.

Anywho...

I feel that for 8 screens, the tar bubble is just...out of nowhere and used for the sake of being used.

I don't really now anything about JDC's part of the level if he uses the tar bubbles a lot; but to anyone who chooses go your route first, Daizo, that Tar Bubble will be pretty insignificant, since, well, it's only used once (for now) and 5 screens in.

What I am trying to say is quickly introduced these things, like, in the first two screens, and after that use it (and the other bubbles) thoroughly; we already now the feel of going through a cave, so why not give the feel of "swimming through floating bubbles out of nowhere to get through a cave".

I say focus more on those awesome bubbles.

But, in its current form, I like it. I don't quite like that Bro in this level though; Bros in any official Mario game are rarely used, and in this hack it's like it everywhere///exaggeration

Try looking through the default sprites and the custom sprites for rarely used enemies.
I'm not too fond of the randomly strewn blocks of metal thrown in without reason in the stone walls, it feels unprofessional. Just my opinion though, it's nothing big.
Originally posted by Giant Shy Guy
I feel that for 8 screens, the tar bubble is just...out of nowhere and used for the sake of being used.


Well you have a point there, Perhaps I could place on in the beginning.

Originally posted by Giant Shy Guy
I don't really now anything about JDC's part of the level if he uses the tar bubbles a lot; but to anyone who chooses go your route first, Daizo, that Tar Bubble will be pretty insignificant, since, well, it's only used once (for now) and 5 screens in.


Well you can find an IPS somewhere in the thread.

And yes, JDC did use the bubbles sometimes, he also used some bubble sprites but they cause problems in my part of the level sadly #w{=(}

Originally posted by Giant Shy Guy
What I am trying to say is quickly introduced these things, like, in the first two screens, and after that use it (and the other bubbles) thoroughly; we already now the feel of going through a cave, so why not give the feel of "swimming through floating bubbles out of nowhere to get through a cave".

I say focus more on those awesome bubbles.


All right, I'll try to use them more often.

Originally posted by Giant Shy Guy
But, in its current form, I like it. I don't quite like that Bro in this level though; Bros in any official Mario game are rarely used, and in this hack it's like it everywhere///exaggeration


O_O JDC used some so why can't I?

Originally posted by Giant Shy Guy
Try looking through the default sprites and the custom sprites for rarely used enemies.


I did an all I can really use is monty moles, pokeys and bros #w{=(}
@JDC, You're fine right now for the most part mainly because you've shown progress and what I've seen is mostly fine. It's Daizo's part that is kind of questionable right now.

As far as Daizo's screenshot, there are elements in this version that need to be played out to see if I like. Screens 0, 1, and maybe 7 and 8 are the best parts. The middles need something. Screen 2 has a Sliding Koopa that (may) run and go through the wall. Screen 3 has 0 enemies, Screen 4 has that Goomba that may cause trouble here. I don't think JDC is using the Bubble for Screen 5, check that one. Screen 6 has a Boomerang Bro that might backup and die instantly. Bare in mind there could be problems that I don't know of that can't be seen in a screenshot.

As far as the Bullet Bill Generator, I don't know what kind of effect you'll have with the tar/sand here in this area. Is it instant death or just a wall that moves and pushes Mario forward? The generator shoots from both the Left and Right and it wouldn't make any sense to shoot from the left because the tar/sand will be in the way.

As a note, I hope that you're testing this while making it even if we are not playing it.
Originally posted by Daizo
Originally posted by Giant Shy Guy
But, in its current form, I like it. I don't quite like that Bro in this level though; Bros in any official Mario game are rarely used, and in this hack it's like it everywhere///exaggeration


O_O JDC used some so why can't I?


Nevermind I said this; I just realized how an awesome combination it will be...


Originally posted by Daizo
Originally posted by Giant Shy Guy
Try looking through the default sprites and the custom sprites for rarely used enemies.


I did an all I can really use is monty moles, pokeys and bros #w{=(}


Hmm...Dino Rhino?

I don't know now...actually...
OK, I think I've finished it, I just need you guy to give me Feedback/Criticism for me before its official.

Download =P

Yep, I would show a video but I don't want to use up my bandwidth (I have lots but I made my self a limit pur day).

What to ignore: (cstutor89 (or anyone else), please ignore all of them!)
-The bubbles are Still beta, will be redrawn by yours truly and JDC.
-The "Hot tar"s GFX is just a place holder, Well be replaced by a drawn version of it, once again, will be drawn by ether me or JDC.

All of these things are going to be fixed when we are more complete, what do you think?
this lvl sux the gfx looks bad 0/100

~~

Anywho:

Screen 1: Move that power-up block; as Big Mario, it's hard to attain the Fire Flower, and as small Mario, the Mushroom will fall off quickly anyways.

I really have nothing else to say...other than at least moving the whoel ceilign at least 1 tile; it's too "claustrophobic" and we already have a lot of low of ceiling caves.

Also...too JDC...

Oh my God JDC only B screens and already 1316 objects! (highlight the level and look at the status bar)

Please see the Level Optimization thread somewhere in the main SMWCP2 forum! A lot of the tiles in the level could just be done away with decreasing Z order.

Oh; it takes up avoidable space in the ROM; it's small and "insignificant", but something that can be avoided might as well be avoided.
Originally posted by Giant Shy Guy
this lvl sux the gfx looks bad 0/100

oh no, should i start over xD Dx

Originally posted by Giant Shy Guy
Anywho:

Screen 1: Move that power-up block; as Big Mario, it's hard to attain the Fire Flower, and as small Mario, the Mushroom will fall off quickly anyways.

Ahh, I shall #w{=D}

Originally posted by Giant Shy Guy
I really have nothing else to say...other than at least moving the whoel ceilign at least 1 tile; it's too "claustrophobic" and we already have a lot of low of ceiling caves.

OK, this might be hard to do but I shall do it.
Okay after testing this level thoroughly, I will say that it is better than I expected and better than what I've seen before. HOWEVER ... both sides are not out of the woods yet with either part.

Here are the big issues I've found:

As I've said the level is better than before, Daizo, but there are issues with it that make no sense. On a general sense the whole environment has a certain awkwardness to it. The colors seem to be all over the map, there's a green and blue pipe that seems to be bright and then there's a darkened yellow pipe/coins/boxes. There's a white stone on the Layer 3 background that doesn't fit and the Bullet Bill Launcher being yellow is kind of weird.

As far as the lava/sand/tar, which I still don't know what that's going to be, that is a fake square that kills Mario on the spot and doesn't kill any enemies on the spot. The sparkies can't go through the lava/sand/tar and come out of it.

And I'm guessing with the usage of Green Switch Blocks you don't know what comes after this level's secret exit? It's the only path to the Green Switch Palace. This Secret Exit helps Mario out if he has the Green Switch Blocks, but he'll never have it until after he beats this level. Hence, why it doesn't make any sense to have them unless Mario's replaying the level.

The tar doesn't work as expected either. The tar in the floor really needs to have priority while the tar in the air really needs to have no priority. And wasn't it decided that these bubbles we're going to be used?

The mechanical blocks feel a little bit tacked on in general in this level. They don't serve too much of a purpose other than try to pass this level off as a mechanical level. Which arrives me to the point of the level name not making any sense - I hardly see any resemblance to a mechanical feel to the level nor do I see anything of a mirage at all in this level.

As far as the little things:
- Screen 0: Blue Pipe's colors (the Black) doesn't work.
- Screen 3: Don't need the Yellow Switch Block.
- Screen 4: Kind of a pointless ladder especially in a rushed situation since all you have to do is jump up to the next platform.
- Screens 5-7: A bit dry with only 2 Green Koopas
- Screen 8: No turning back if I miss that jump, there's not enough time to rejump and could might as well be a pit.

So yeah, there's a lot still to fix and finish up here and consider. And I don't think that spotlight takes that long to put in either.
Originally posted by cstutor89
Okay after testing this level thoroughly, I will say that it is better than I expected and better than what I've seen before. HOWEVER ... both sides are not out of the woods yet with either part.

Here are the big issues I've found:

As I've said the level is better than before, Daizo, but there are issues with it that make no sense. On a general sense the whole environment has a certain awkwardness to it. The colors seem to be all over the map, there's a green and blue pipe that seems to be bright and then there's a darkened yellow pipe/coins/boxes. There's a white stone on the Layer 3 background that doesn't fit and the Bullet Bill Launcher being yellow is kind of weird.

As far as the lava/sand/tar, which I still don't know what that's going to be, that is a fake square that kills Mario on the spot and doesn't kill any enemies on the spot. The sparkies can't go through the lava/sand/tar and come out of it.

And I'm guessing with the usage of Green Switch Blocks you don't know what comes after this level's secret exit? It's the only path to the Green Switch Palace. This Secret Exit helps Mario out if he has the Green Switch Blocks, but he'll never have it until after he beats this level. Hence, why it doesn't make any sense to have them unless Mario's replaying the level.

The tar doesn't work as expected either. The tar in the floor really needs to have priority while the tar in the air really needs to have no priority. And wasn't it decided that these bubbles we're going to be used?

The mechanical blocks feel a little bit tacked on in general in this level. They don't serve too much of a purpose other than try to pass this level off as a mechanical level. Which arrives me to the point of the level name not making any sense - I hardly see any resemblance to a mechanical feel to the level nor do I see anything of a mirage at all in this level.

As far as the little things:
- Screen 0: Blue Pipe's colors (the Black) doesn't work.
- Screen 3: Don't need the Yellow Switch Block.
- Screen 4: Kind of a pointless ladder especially in a rushed situation since all you have to do is jump up to the next platform.
- Screens 5-7: A bit dry with only 2 Green Koopas
- Screen 8: No turning back if I miss that jump, there's not enough time to rejump and could might as well be a pit.

So yeah, there's a lot still to fix and finish up here and consider. And I don't think that spotlight takes that long to put in either.


May I justr point out that the Beta IPS I've sent to DK is quite old is and therefore, most of those have been fixed on my end.

Yeah.
Originally posted by cstutor89
Okay after testing this level thoroughly, I will say that it is better than I expected and better than what I've seen before. HOWEVER ... both sides are not out of the woods yet with either part.

At least I know that its better.

Originally posted by cstutor89
Here are the big issues I've found:

Uh, Oh....Please don't be bad, please don't be too bad.....

Originally posted by cstutor89
As I've said the level is better than before, Daizo, but there are issues with it that make no sense. On a general sense the whole environment has a certain awkwardness to it. The colors seem to be all over the map, there's a green and blue pipe that seems to be bright and then there's a darkened yellow pipe/coins/boxes. There's a white stone on the Layer 3 background that doesn't fit and the Bullet Bill Launcher being yellow is kind of weird.

Perhaps I should of said the Colours are still beta, but I didn't so...I'll fix this.

Plus the reason why the bullet bill launchers are yellow is because its original palette is used, so to prevent a really ugly Bullet Shooter I made its palette yellow, What is wrong with yellow?

Originally posted by cstutor89
As far as the lava/sand/tar, which I still don't know what that's going to be, that is a fake square that kills Mario on the spot and doesn't kill any enemies on the spot. The sparkies can't go through the lava/sand/tar and come out of it.

Its still going to be hot tar but with different GFX.

And it won't come out of it, thats the point with the sparkies, Its odd to have a sparkie go out of tar anyways :/

Originally posted by cstutor89
And I'm guessing with the usage of Green Switch Blocks you don't know what comes after this level's secret exit? It's the only path to the Green Switch Palace. This Secret Exit helps Mario out if he has the Green Switch Blocks, but he'll never have it until after he beats this level. Hence, why it doesn't make any sense to have them unless Mario's replaying the level.


Well I guess I'll get rid of the green blocks, I wasn't really sure ether :/

Originally posted by cstutor89
The tar doesn't work as expected either. The tar in the floor really needs to have priority while the tar in the air really needs to have no priority. And wasn't it decided that these bubbles we're going to be used?

Didn't JDC say to ignore the priority issues with the tar...?

Originally posted by cstutor89
The mechanical blocks feel a little bit tacked on in general in this level. They don't serve too much of a purpose other than try to pass this level off as a mechanical level. Which arrives me to the point of the level name not making any sense - I hardly see any resemblance to a mechanical feel to the level nor do I see anything of a mirage at all in this level.

0_0 I'll go talk to JDC about how to get this going, plus the name is not final ether so yeah.

Originally posted by cstutor89
As far as the little things:
- Screen 0: Blue Pipe's colors (the Black) doesn't work.
- Screen 3: Don't need the Yellow Switch Block.
- Screen 4: Kind of a pointless ladder especially in a rushed situation since all you have to do is jump up to the next platform.
- Screens 5-7: A bit dry with only 2 Green Koopas
- Screen 8: No turning back if I miss that jump, there's not enough time to rejump and could might as well be a pit.

-Actaully the oil take one palette out of palette 7 so its not black, its dark DARK brown, if thats too much of a problem (Which will), Removed anyways.
-All right.
-Well I don't want it to look too boring, but removed anyways.
-Removed the koopas and replaced them with something else.
-OK, I put some yellow switch blocks so its easyer if you got the Yellow Switch.

Originally posted by cstutor89
So yeah, there's a lot still to fix and finish up here and consider. And I don't think that spotlight takes that long to put in either.

Well the spot light's GFX are already overwritten so that would be impossible.

Edit: Ninja'd, also, as JDC said, the IPS I have is very VERY old.
The bad thing about a yellow shooter is that it's not black.
We need consistency, and I don't really see a good reason for it to be yellow to begin with.
Originally posted by leod
The bad thing about a yellow shooter is that it's not black.
We need consistency, and I don't really see a good reason for it to be yellow to begin with.


Well I manage to fix that, but I still don't see the problem with a yellow shooter :/

I will give an IPS after JDC tests it.
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