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| (RESULTS) 5th Annual SMWCentral Level Design Competition |
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Forum Index - Archive - Old Contests & Events - (RESULTS) 5th Annual SMWCentral Level Design Competition |
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| Posted on 2012-04-14 09:18:23 PM |
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QuoteNow its stupid for you? i remmember you saying before you were taking this contest judging seriously after someone said you were going too far with this. Can't find a quotation right now
unfortunately.everything else was covered up there i hope.
I take it you've never heard of hyperbole, then.
QuoteIt's nice to talk with you and all, but this quoting thing will go on and on until a mod come and put an end on it. so i'll be off, my point have been made. Kisses :*
So not only are you taking a negative standpoint on your level too much to heart so that you'll make a personal vendetta against the judge that scored you the lowest, but you're also showing arrogance. As someone who is known around here very well, a rather respected member of the site, not to mention being the current Member of the Month (in a way, you're putting a bad blemish on the title), you by this point you should know better than and to be above.
Your method of "trying to be rude to people who are 'rude'" doesn't really work out either. Not only does it make you look like a hypocrite, it also serves to aggravate the targeted person(s), which will only lead to bad things for all parties in the future if it's not cut at the bud before it grows out of control. Your issue here, Ludus is that you're taking my style of feedback (which is often blunt and straight to the point; which is not exclusive to you) and the fact that I didn't feel your level was good far too personally, yet you try to proclaim "I ain't even mad" when it clearly shows in how blatant you chose to publicly slander me (directly) and Axem/FirePhoenix (indirectly). We do not expect all of the entrants to take what we say to heart, no, but we also expect you people to respond with some tact- something your posts in this topic clearly lack.
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| Posted on 2012-04-14 09:57:10 PM |
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Originally posted by Ludus
Originally posted by MDPYou really are determined at making this a personal issue... all over a stupid level design contest.
Now its stupid for you? i remmember you saying before you were taking this contest judging seriously after someone said you were going too far with this. Can't find a quotation right now unfortunately.
Oh god please tell me you're joking.
Stop taking this so damn personally. MDP can be harsh and blunt, yes, but he is also a very great judge from what I've seen in both his commentary here and on testing levels in SMWCP2 and I have a large amount of respect for him. So I suggest you stop making a fool of yourself and trying to start shit.
Your level may look nice but you failed to focus on level design; you know, the theme of this contest. Maybe if this was a "Best Vanilla Graphics Contest" you would have gotten a higher score but your score for this contest is reasonable. The cameo was bad because you forced it to draw attention to the player; same with the cutscene.
God why do certain people take this contest so seriously? It's not like you're getting a golden trophy with a jewel-embedded stand or anything.
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| Posted on 2012-04-14 11:13:53 PM |
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Ludus, if you have a problem with MrDeePay's behavior on this site, this really isn't the place to address that, and I would also call your methodology into question as ruthlessly extreme. MrDeePay is not a cackling villain who delights in schadenfreude; from what I've gathered, he's a member of several communities (both on and offline) who simply doesn't have time to prevaricate about the bush. The candid commentary he provides is not limited to your level, nor is it a premeditated act of aggression. It's simply the way he prefers to give feedback. If you don't personally agree with that style of feedback, that's fine, but you should still treat MrDeePay with some civility. He's contributed a lot to this community and has useful experience. Need I also remind you that you're currently a member of the month? Shouldn't you set a better example by not letting your personal grudges interfere with a thread devoted to contest discussion? Moreover, if you disagree with judges' scores or comments, shouldn't the next step be to civilly discuss the design rather than pitch rock-filled snowballs at each other? Regardless of at whom those snowballs are aimed, when you insult one judge you're really insulting them all. Not to mention, if you think the answer to rudeness is just to be rude yourself...well, I entreat you to try a different approach, as that just escalates the situation.
I'm not going to respond to the majority of your intentionally inflammatory comments, as that's a zero-sum game and is unrelated to the contest. I am, however, perfectly fine with discussing your entry so long as you keep a civil tongue, and not just around me.
Originally posted by Ludusvanilla for me is the art of doing unique things with the given resources, i love to give smw a new look and see how far i can get.
This mindset is completely fine, and nobody is accusing you of focusing 100% on visual appeal- if that were the case, your entry would have scored much, much lower. However, our job as judges is to determine whether the result creates a good experience, and MrDeePay and I felt that some of your decisions detracted from the overall appeal. Firephoenix didn't feel as strongly about it, and that's fine too.
Your sprite placement wasn't terrible; it could have been better, is all. It's not like all 6 points I didn't give you in level design were due to something as arbitrary as having flying enemies or not; there were multiple factors. I've noticed that MrDeePay has already brought up points with regard to the spritework that you seem to have ignored so far in subsequent posts...and I agree with those points. I'd also like to add the issue of sprite distribution: many of the sprites are encountered in isolation or in pairs, making it uninteresting to deal with them. I have nothing wrong with pursuing an early-game, low-difficulty level, but you can achieve that and still have complex spritework. Adding flying enemies is only one way to give variety; I was making the broader point that, in aiming to be easy, you assume the spritework needs to be simple, which isn't necessarily the case. Also, take a look at some of the highest-scoring entries to see what they did with sprites. I'm not saying this to offend you, but some entrants were quite a bit more creative with sprites than you were. I suppose the easiest example to use is yoshicookiezeus' level, but take a look around- there are others as well.
Originally posted by LudusI get what you just said. Guess i did not made my point clear. An example is, a judge don't like the color Blue, and an entry uses a blue palette. And he penalizes the level because of that. Hope you got my point now.
Oh, don't get me wrong- beyond a certain point, docking points due to personal preference without any supporting reasoning is usually not a good idea. However, speaking for myself, when I took off points for the cutscenes in your entry, it wasn't just a case of "I don't like it." There are several ways I feel it detracts from the design, doesn't fit the contest, or is distasteful overall:
-Interrupts the flow/pacing of the level
-Takes a while to get through
-Nonsequiturish plot that will leave many new players wondering what is going on
-Reduces any sense of climax and fulfillment by abruptly taking away player participation in the level's final moments
-Intentionally ignores the spirit of the contest by expending a lot of effort on non-essentials
Originally posted by LudusHypocrisy is a funny word. People tend to use it everytime for whatever the reason, but i do not feel offended by this word, i just find it funny.
The reason I think you're being hypocritical in this thread is that you're implying MrDeePay should be more modest, whereas your tone of voice/attitude is anything but modest. In fact, I would describe it as arrogant and conceited.
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To everyone else: I see there are a few other comments I need to address as well; I'll post again/edit this post/PM later (whichever is appropriate at the time).
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| Posted on 2012-04-14 11:59:39 PM |
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Why's everybody whining and making a scene? Oh, wait, this happens every year, doesn't it? I guess not even the people of this website are immune to the effects of human stupidity, the inability to accept criticism as anything but personal attack. I make levels for fun, not to whine about how everyone hates my "SPECIAL SNOWFLAKE GFX AND LEVEL DESIGN". Heck, I'll go as far as to admit when my stuff is utter crap. Have some humility.
I even thought the judges had a lot of valid commentary on the levels. Considering that I hardly take this place seriously anymore, that's shockingly impressive.
Now, to throw in my two cents about my own level-- I can see why the whole bullet bill shooter thing got a tad annoying for some (namely the judges), but I was sort of going for a Castlevania vibe. It's no use justifying the reasoning behind that, now that judging is over, but I feel like I should at least mention it. I could have executed it in a less repetitive manner, but for what it's worth, it does suit its purpose. Instead of expecting to rush through the level for the sake of getting over with, I feel that the level should be kinder to players that take their time. You can get through Castlevania if you think about your moves rather than hold a direction and mash the jump button, right? I did give an overly-generous time limit for a reason. I neglected to balance the placement of powerups, but I know what to do to improve upon that level now.
Things like this are a learning experience. (Even though, most would feel shame for falling behind in ranks over time as I have.)
And the more you learn from your experiences, the better you can perform at a later time.
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| Last edited on 2012-04-15 12:12:06 AM by RedToonLink. |
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| Posted on 2012-04-15 12:09:25 AM |
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Originally posted by RedToonLinkOh, wait, this happens every year, doesn't it?
Not to this degree.
People really need to stop fucking angsting over this. The feedback is meant to be helpful here. All three judges are very experienced in level design, and have been around for many years doing stuff with the game and/or critiquing stuff in general. They're not professionals (and neither is anyone who is hacking a ROM, really, or else they'd actually be working for a top shot game design company), but they know their shit. Rather than biting their head off, it might be worth taking what they say into consideration (general note for anyone who is offering backlash here).
In the end, this was a level design contest. The top ten entries are prime examples of what solid level design is, not how fancy one can get with their tileset mixing skills.
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| Posted on 2012-04-15 12:24:28 AM |
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Originally posted by S.N.N.In the end, this was a level design contest. The top ten entries are prime examples of what solid level design is, not how fancy one can get with their tileset mixing skills.
I hate that we have to keep repeating this every day. And even then, people still don't get it...
I'm completely fine with how this year's contest turned out, and i'm glad for the scores i received. I already said this to Riolu180 on IRC, but congrats to all of them on their levels.
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| Posted on 2012-04-15 01:07:46 AM |
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Originally posted by S.N.N.In the end, this was a level design contest. The top ten entries are prime examples of what solid level design is, not how fancy one can get with their tileset mixing skills.
Except that FirePhoenix just revealed that he gave one of the levels a 5.5 out of 5.
RECOUNT IS REQUIRED
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| Posted on 2012-04-15 01:08:23 AM |
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Goddamn it Bush, give me back Florida!
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| Posted on 2012-04-15 01:20:15 AM |
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also I'm streaming again. Going in order of hacks, first place to whenever I decide to quit!
(Also I'm glad you banned me from putting up ads, so we can stare at anime ass all day. <3)
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| Posted on 2012-04-15 02:35:20 AM |
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Oh wow, it's always so tiring to read the results thread. There's three pages filled with a discussion about one entry!
I don't see how you could question the judging, getting mad at one person, while you got roughly the same score from all three.
A LEVEL DESIGN contest is about LEVEL DESIGN, not about graphical design. You think your level deserves a higher score, just because it looks nice, even though you're not saying it.
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| Posted on 2012-04-15 05:47:38 AM |
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Woo, 10th place! To be honest, I actually expected to place lower, given the level's short length and lack of difficulty. 
I agree with the judges' criticisms for the most part; I probably would have addressed many of those issues had I not run out of time, as I explained in the original discussion thread. (To think I used to stay up all night working on SMO...how times have changed.)
Congrats to all the winners, and special thanks to the judges for taking the time to provide detailed feedback!
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| Posted on 2012-04-15 06:05:45 AM |
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Wow, how the heck do you get an f***ing midwaypoint to work in a vertical level, I mean come on, I tried every single way .I really hate fixing glitches in vanilla levels .
Also, if what I've understood is correct, level design seems to consist on sprite placement and dificulty being hard enough yet posible, yet I doubt a chalenging level with great sprite placement composed of cementblocks would get 20 on level design and 0 on aescetics.
Really, level design should consist of whole level design, yet since ,like over 80% of people here, I am nobody, who cares?
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| Posted on 2012-04-15 07:05:27 AM |
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Originally posted by xlkWow, how the heck do you get an f***ing midwaypoint to work in a vertical level, I mean come on, I tried every single way .
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I think it only works on odd numbered screens.
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| Posted on 2012-04-15 07:19:48 AM |
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wtf?man smw is weird...Thanks thought.
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| Posted on 2012-04-15 10:42:30 AM |
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Damnit, if I'd not have internet problems those days, I'd make also one level and show you how to make a real vanilla level.
Well, congats for the winners!
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| Posted on 2012-04-15 01:15:03 PM |
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Originally posted by xlkWow, how the heck do you get an f***ing midwaypoint to work in a vertical level, I mean come on, I tried every single way .I really hate fixing glitches in vanilla levels .
You can't have midway entrances on screen 00.
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| Posted on 2012-04-15 02:05:18 PM |
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You got to be kiding, was that the reason why it didn't work?Wow, vertical levels shure are glitchy
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| Posted on 2012-04-15 02:21:25 PM |
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Originally posted by xlkYou got to be kiding, was that the reason why it didn't work?Wow, vertical levels shure are glitchy
Well, SMW was the first time Nintendo managed to create a "perfect" vertical level - vertical levels before hand had really choppy scrolling and the side loop "glitch", which was something game developers then didn't know how to fix.
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| Posted on 2012-04-15 02:32:23 PM |
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QuoteYou got to be kiding, was that the reason why it didn't work?Wow, vertical levels shure are glitchy
Actually, midway entrance doesn't work in both horizontal and vertical levels when it is on screen 00.
Both horizontal and vertical levels are glitchy. 
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| Last edited on 2012-04-15 02:34:24 PM by yogui. |
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| Posted on 2012-04-15 04:50:12 PM |
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I just want to say that I'm really happy to see how my level placed in this contest (I actually expected myself to place something like 20th),
which I really enjoyed being part of.
Also congratulations to the winners (is YCZ a level design master or something?! ^.^), I hope I'll be able to play your entries as soon as possible (probably tomorrow).
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Forum Index - Archive - Old Contests & Events - (RESULTS) 5th Annual SMWCentral Level Design Competition |
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