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124: Shivering Cinders - MrDeePay

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Increasing its speed might be a good idea as well, but that sounds fine. Alternately, you could have them spit temporary solid ice pillars, although I guess that wouldn't add to the difficulty much.

Maybe you could have an enemy that encases itself in harmful ice to defend itself from Mario, but is otherwise stompable.

Or perhaps a chuck that tosses ice cubes at you, or slides them on the floor toward you. Actually, that also reminds me of a SMB3 enemy whose name I can't remember.
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The problem with a Chuck is that the level uses Hammer Bros, which will cause a lot of troublesome work with rearranging tilemaps so they can co-exist in a single level. This is the basic idea I got with the Dino-Torch variant.

Moves around like the normal version, but if he opens his mouth straight ahead, he'll spit out an icy spore (It can even randomly be 1-3 if you want to be a little trickier.) If he opens his mouth up above him, he'll spit out an icy spore that behaves like the fireballs you would expect from a Panser. This icy spore would have the behavior of the iceballs the Ice Bros in the level (and thusly NSMBW) in which they'll damage Mario and freeze him in place for a few seconds. The Dino-Torch (and other enemies) could use this to their advantage to attack Mario either with their own abilities or just charge into them.

Allowing the enemy to move faster than the normal Dino-Torch might prove to make him more of an annoyance if his attack rate is increased as well. I guess I can set up some GFX space for the enemy soon.

Oh, I didn't realize how much you were changing the nature of the attack (moving spores vs stationary flame). A speed increase certainly might be excessive in that case.

Anyway, I like the concept. Having both variants in the same room would be interesting.
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Now that I think about it, having the actual Dino-Rhinos in the level doesn't seem like a bad idea, but it will require some work (obviously) to redo some parts around them. However, I already have plenty of Fire elements in the level as is, so I'm more likely to save that idea for my own game.

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http://www.smwcentral.net/?p=viewthread&pid=770727 - Finally made the request for that sprite that I was talking about in addition for some sprite GFX, so we'll see how that goes.

Currently I've been messing around with the first Yoshi room; which includes the two methods of SWMC Coin collecting I mentioned at the start of the topic. Yes, I'm actually making Yoshi required for one of them. Why? Mainly to show that with appropriate designing, you can prevent him from "breaking" your level and that there are more uses for him rather than the "extra hit" crap everyone cops out with. It's not that difficult to do, folks.

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Originally posted by AxemJinx

Still, I hope some people do update soon. In particular, Worlds 2, 4, 6, and 7 haven't seen much activity in general. If you're designing a level in one of those worlds, please post something! I would love to comment on what you have, even if it's incomplete, and to try helping out if you have problems or requests. After all, teamwork is supposed to help SMWCP2 rise above its predecessor, right?


Something.










Started work on the remaining sublevel I had claimed, which would be that pipe that was near the checkpoint in the IPS I linked long ago that only big Mario could enter. This sublevel will try to utilize the slippery ON/OFF blocks more as opposed to how infrequent they were in the rest of the level. Also it'll (most likely) house the last SMWC Coin, but I haven't reached that point yet in planning I just came up with a particularly cruel one just now.

Man oh man do I just love making presses Switch Palace switches have the potential of making things harder for the player.



Edit: Hell yeah Yuuka!

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Showing some parts of a "puzzle" (if you can call it that) which houses the last SMWC Coin, thus having all of the coins in the level require at least three different statuses to get them all. The rest of the sublevel shouldn't be (too) difficult to create while utilizing the slippery ON/OFF blocks, so I'll get to work on that next.

I ripped the SMWC Coin my WYE's most recent graphic mainly to see how they'll look in-game.

Originally posted by MrDeePay


Showing some parts of a "puzzle" (if you can call it that) which houses the last SMWC Coin, thus having all of the coins in the level require at least three different statuses to get them all. The rest of the sublevel shouldn't be (too) difficult to create while utilizing the slippery ON/OFF blocks, so I'll get to work on that next.

I ripped the SMWC Coin my WYE's most recent graphic mainly to see how they'll look in-game.

Wow!so thats how the smwc coins look like?
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Originally posted by xlk
Wow!so thats how the smwc coins look like?


Have you been keeping up with collab progress at all? That was one of the earlier graphics done.



(screens taken completely out of order and at very different times)


Grabbed another sublevel so I can hop on the same train other people are (as in: having their levels end where the following one begins). While there are enemies in here, none of them will pose any threat. (Mario will just be too high for any of them to do any harm.) If for some god forsaken reason that the level shuffling causes this level to be before the castle, I'll just redo this sublevel to fit.

It's interesting- everyone who's updating seems very much aware of the concept of tying levels together at the beginning/end.

Based on the screenshots, it looks like you're leading into Firephoenix's stage? Considering I forgot the level order, if that's the case, then you're doing fine in that regard :b

(Then again, whose levels have I seen besides yours and Firephoenix's? ^_^;)
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Originally posted by AxemJinx
Based on the screenshots, it looks like you're leading into Firephoenix's stage? Considering I forgot the level order, if that's the case, then you're doing fine in that regard :b


Yeah it does... for the second time.

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http://bin.smwcentral.net/u/1365/ShiveringCinders03.ips
- Still have quite a ways to go, but I would like to get an online backup of my progress in the event something happens again like last time. Mainly just the rest of sublevel D4 and various housekeeping and whatever changes I need to do depending on the feedback that I get on this.

- Ignore some Map16 shenanigans with the Frozen block.
- All pipes now (should) lead to their intended destination points.
- Fire pillar cutoff has been corrected, but in order to expand the versatility of ExGFX 1B2 (sp4), I moved their graphics to 1B1 (sp3), so ignore the screwy graphics they now have.
- Ignore glitched Venus Fire Traps
- Yoshi shouldn't glitch anymore when near Podoboos.
- Again, for testing purposes, Mario has infinite lives.
- Test the level with every scenario that you can. The Hub has all of the Switch Palace switches for convenience in trying the level out, so use it.
- When you see the level "suddenly" end in sublevel D4, the bottom row can be safely walked on so you can reach the exit pipe, which will (currently) lead to the starting area of Volcanic Panic. If level shuffling causes this level to be before a different level, I'll just redesign sublevel D0 to reflect that.

Oh, your level looks really "cool" (as one might say) in the sort of "hot" sense that this level gives. Your ideas seem pretty well designed too, and superbly planned out. I'll see if I can some how incorporate your ending as the beginning of my level (or it could go the other way around). Either way, I wish you the best of luck on your level.
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Originally posted by metalgearhunter
I'll see if I can some how incorporate your ending as the beginning of my level (or it could go the other way around). Either way, I wish you the best of luck on your level.



Uhh...


Level 125 (you) leads into 126 (Jimmy).

Oh... well, you're level 124, so naturally (by my hacks) I assumed you were before me.
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I have to say, this level's starting to grow on me. I think it's the way it constantly changes. I'm not just talking about all the different kinds of blocks you have, either- the environment/terrain, the types of obstacles, enemies...you always have to be actively thinking about what you're doing. For example, without any switch palace blocks, there's an emphasis on tough jumps, but with them, there's a greater abundance of enemies. There's a spot where the blue ones block a fire flower; there's a spot where the yellow ones make it harder (in a clever way) to get a smwcoin. You've clearly put a lot of thought into how each specific block makes certain areas easy/hard, which is great. There also seems to be both an exploration- and skill-based method for getting two of the smwcoins, which is really nice because it accommodates different playstyles and may surprise players.

There are some exits that lead to weird places or don't exist, but I'm assuming this is because the level's still under construction.

Anyway, I have a few specific comments:

D1, screen 9: If players use this yellow switch block for the mushroom, can they reach the ledge?

screen A: Unless players see it while reaching the ledge, they probably won't know those Yoshi blocks are there until they spin-jump on the turn blocks. Maybe you could arrange them diagonally toward the pipe?

screen C: I assume the melt-able blocks aren't inserted yet? Or are these something else? (I also noticed some blank map16 tiles in the level- what are they supposed to be?)

D2, screen 10: You should probably raise the ledges around this pipe, since stubborn players might continue on and "over-explore," only to find no additional exit pipes or secrets. This is more of an issue traveling right->left, but it applies both ways, I think. If you want to block players absolutely, then you'd also have to put Yoshi blocks there or something.

screen 11: You may want to consider making the 1up passage one tile wider. The first time around, I missed with the springboard and had to dismount up there. I guess it is a 1up, but I thought I'd bring it up at least.

D3, screen 7 (left): You can jump up from the p-switch platform and circumvent that setup- shouldn't you lower the platform a couple of tiles?

screen 7 (right): Since it's more of a trudge to bring the springboard here, I feel like you should have more coins in this room, at least.

screen 5: Where do you access this entrance from?

124, screen 10 (right): Not a huge deal, but you can reach the central platform without the red switch palace blocks using some clever full-speed jumps.

D5, screen 2 (bottom): Players don't know what's down there the first time around, so when the freezie drops down there, it's a bit of a blind drop. Also, when I first entered this sublevel, I tried sliding and immediately regretted it :b I'm more worried about the former issue, though.

screen 5 (bottom): Might just be me, but it felt a little hard to tell there was a platform there. Also, the harder way to get the coin is clever.

screen 8 (right): Again, I think you can get these with a full-speed jump even without the on/off blocks.



Anyway, this is looking pretty good overall, though I admit the majority of my testing has been without the majority of switch palace blocks activated. I guess I'll swing by again once you work on sublevel D4 and see if I have any additional comments with some combination testing.
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Originally posted by AxemJinx

D1, screen 9: If players use this yellow switch block for the mushroom, can they reach the ledge?


Yeah they should be able to.

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screen A: Unless players see it while reaching the ledge, they probably won't know those Yoshi blocks are there until they spin-jump on the turn blocks. Maybe you could arrange them diagonally toward the pipe?


All of my testing of that sublevel never gave me the scenario of the camera being shifted up to have the Yoshi blocks be out of view, but I suppose that's a fitting alternative, so I'll change that.

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screen C: I assume the melt-able blocks aren't inserted yet? Or are these something else? (I also noticed some blank map16 tiles in the level- what are they supposed to be?)


Oh they are, but the default Map16 behavior for the block is set to 25 and I flat-out forgot to switch it to 130 for this patch.

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D2, screen 10: You should probably raise the ledges around this pipe, since stubborn players might continue on and "over-explore," only to find no additional exit pipes or secrets. This is more of an issue traveling right->left, but it applies both ways, I think. If you want to block players absolutely, then you'd also have to put Yoshi blocks there or something.


I figured the signs pointing towards the pipe would be a big enough of a hint to tell them to go this or that way. Then again, I also attempt to sucker the player with the sign through the cape entrance to D2 (Screen 17), so I see what you mean.

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screen 11: You may want to consider making the 1up passage one tile wider. The first time around, I missed with the springboard and had to dismount up there. I guess it is a 1up, but I thought I'd bring it up at least.


Do you mean that Mario hit his head on a ceiling that the player couldn't see, meaning that they (unfairly) missed out on a 1up? If so, I'll change it, if not... I'll change it anyway.

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D3, screen 7 (left): You can jump up from the p-switch platform and circumvent that setup- shouldn't you lower the platform a couple of tiles?


Funny, I was building that part so Mario couldn't fly his way up there (and looking at it in LM, it's still possible thanks to Screen 6) and I completely overlooked the fact that I could've easily set placed the P-Switch on a block that's solid only to sprites. That just goes to show that one error is all it can take to mess something up. I'll get onto preventing the whole thing from being break-free.

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screen 7 (right): Since it's more of a trudge to bring the springboard here, I feel like you should have more coins in this room, at least.


Will do.

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screen 5: Where do you access this entrance from?


Level 124, Screen 8 leads to that pipe, which would be the skill-based method to that coin.

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124, screen 10 (right): Not a huge deal, but you can reach the central platform without the red switch palace blocks using some clever full-speed jumps.


It's possible, but I can't really picturing many people trying to do it that way unless they don't have the Blue Switch either. But for those scenarios, I suppose it can be kept in.

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D5, screen 2 (bottom): Players don't know what's down there the first time around, so when the freezie drops down there, it's a bit of a blind drop. Also, when I first entered this sublevel, I tried sliding and immediately regretted it :b I'm more worried about the former issue, though.


A personal rule of mine is that to give an idle Mario (including one that's moving down a slope) about 3-4 seconds before you can start to damage him. I originally had the Frostee on the right side of the ledge, but that meant he could hit Mario before those 3-4 seconds would expire, so I put him up there. All of my slide tests would cause Mario to take out the Frostee as long as Mario didn't jump. But the Blind hit issue can be troublesome, so I'll rearrange that setup.

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screen 5 (bottom): Might just be me, but it felt a little hard to tell there was a platform there.


What platform do you mean? The Slippery red/ON one?

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Also, the harder way to get the coin is clever.


Technically, there's only one way for that coin, but how much time it takes depends on the Yellow Switch- which surprisingly can make or break whether you get the last coin.

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screen 8 (right): Again, I think you can get these with a full-speed jump even without the on/off blocks.


The only thing Mario should be able to get in that scenario is the Mushroom (if he's small). The ceiling should be too low for him to reach the top of the blocks from the raised ledge on the right, meaning that he'll miss out on the Flower and Yoshi if he doesn't have a Cape.

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Anyway, this is looking pretty good overall, though I admit the majority of my testing has been without the majority of switch palace blocks activated. I guess I'll swing by again once you work on sublevel D4 and see if I have any additional comments with some combination testing.



Alright then, thanks for the input. I'll see what I can do about it for the rest of the level.

Originally posted by MrDeePay
Originally posted by AxemJinx

D1, screen 9: If players use this yellow switch block for the mushroom, can they reach the ledge?

Yeah they should be able to.

I mean, without a Yoshi or cape, the ceiling looks like it's too low, but then again, I guess players should realize it's a risky proposition anyway?

Originally posted by MrDeePay
Do you mean that Mario hit his head on a ceiling that the player couldn't see, meaning that they (unfairly) missed out on a 1up?

Yep, I couldn't see the ceiling (as I remember), so I couldn't move left in time and the springboard fell into the lava. Luckily, I had Yoshi :b Though I suppose players can grab the springboard too...


Originally posted by MrDeePay
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screen 5: Where do you access this entrance from?

Level 124, Screen 8 leads to that pipe, which would be the skill-based method to that coin.

Oh, that's the one that leads to a weird area of sublevel D4 right now. I guess I was confused because you didn't set it yet.

Originally posted by MrDeePay
All of my slide tests would cause Mario to take out the Frostee as long as Mario didn't jump.

Yeah, it was silly of me to jump- I guess I just reacted without thinking. Don't worry about that part of it.

Originally posted by MrDeePay
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screen 5 (bottom): Might just be me, but it felt a little hard to tell there was a platform there.

What platform do you mean? The Slippery red/ON one?

No, I mean the platform where the yellow switch blocks are. I think it might have just been me not paying attention, though.


Originally posted by MrDeePay
The ceiling should be too low for him to reach the top of the blocks from the raised ledge on the right, meaning that he'll miss out on the Flower and Yoshi if he doesn't have a Cape.

I tested it again, and while the fire flower did go off-screen, I was able to reach Yoshi.


Oh, I forgot something.

D3, screen 3 (bottom left): There seems to be an invisible cement block where the fire bar is. At first I thought maybe I was supposed to bounce on the fire bar, but then I landed on something invisible and it seemed rather odd. Am I not seeing how you're supposed to progress there...?
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Originally posted by Axem
I mean, without a Yoshi or cape, the ceiling looks like it's too low, but then again, I guess players should realize it's a risky proposition anyway?


Oh, I misread what you said. In any case, that spot is more supposed to be a trap- the player isn't supposed to get that Mushroom as the block is to serve to make the jump a little harder.

Originally posted by Axem
Oh, that's the one that leads to a weird area of sublevel D4 right now. I guess I was confused because you didn't set it yet.


Oops, silly me. Looks like I didn't set the secondary exit to the correct level (it should have used secondary exit D5). Well that should be fixed now, though.


Originally posted by Axem
No, I mean the platform where the yellow switch blocks are. I think it might have just been me not paying attention, though.


Oh, I see now. Looking at it right now, I'm not sure what to do with this spot. I could coins near the middle of the platform so players have time to readjust themselves from slipping into the lava, but they'll become an intrusion in the event the P-Switch activates. Decisions, decisions...

Originally posted by Axem
I tested it again, and while the fire flower did go off-screen, I was able to reach Yoshi.


I guess I'll have to keep trying at that, then. If I can't make it, I suppose I could keep it in as a nice bonus for more persistent and skillful players.

More Map16 errors on my part, I didn't use a visible tile there that got lost when porting to updated base ROMs, so some things go through. It's supposed to be a five tile long (firebar's on the far right end) platform.

Originally posted by MrDeePay
Oh, I see now. Looking at it right now, I'm not sure what to do with this spot. I could coins near the middle of the platform so players have time to readjust themselves from slipping into the lava, but they'll become an intrusion in the event the P-Switch activates. Decisions, decisions...

Sorry for the barrage of posts, but in regard to this, maybe if you made a depression in the big platform resting on top of the yellow switch palace blocks such that the camera scrolls down, that might work (though I'm not sure). You could even shorten the yellow switch block wall by one tile to make sure the camera scrolls low enough, if necessary. Players have to pass by there anyway to grab the p-switch, so...just an idea :b I mean, if they're curious, that will serve as a spot they can use to check things out, maybe.
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