(RESULTS) 5th Annual SMWCentral Level Design Competition - Old Contests & Events

Originally posted by Shog

a) why do you said the level not following a constraint theme (example:only pillars) is bad while not considering that one level hacks shoul be "complex" (as stated in hack submission and excluding the "unfinished impression" which is subjective.)

I'm not sure what guidelines you're referring to (perhaps you could link to them?), but the issue I have is that the more quickly you jump to new themes within a level, the harder it is to build on any one of them individually. I like to see levels that take a theme and continue to develop it as the stage goes along. Your entry leans more toward being a variety pack, and while that's not inherently bad, I personally found that the way this particular stage handled it was a bit unfulfilling, is all.

Originally posted by Shog

b) the critic about enemy placement is not fair, because i tjought it out like this: first hard, if you manage it easy til midway point, then hard again (counting teh boss).It makes sense to me because if you die early, you can repeat the early, hardier part again(...atleast i would design future hacks of mine this way, excluding new mechanics which has to be explained in an easy way). Would you mind explaining me what`s so bad about it in your opinion?

I'll admit I didn't really look at it from that perspective, so I may have been a bit harsh on the difficulty progression, but since the midway point appears pretty late in the level, I feel like there's not quite enough time to bump up the difficulty again. The boss is certainly a step up in difficulty, yes, but it also feels kind of luck-based, which I didn't personally like. As I said, though, the spritework was generally good and if there were issues, they weren't particularly egregious and I didn't take off too much for them.

Originally posted by GeminiRage

This is what happens when I try to maintain some sense of proportionality; I ended up dragging that underground tunnel out too long just so that the interior wouldn't feel ridiculous disproportionate, considering that was a right-to-left level.

I was wondering if it was something like that. I will say I did get the impression that I was going back and forth over the same area on different floors, so that's a plus, but I guess you can pay a price for it.

Originally posted by Feenicks

would the level have been better (or scored higher, or whatever) if only the super koopas that were immediately threatening (rather than just a general slowing mechanism or less) were included, rather than having all the super koopas in the stage raised to be threatening?

Personally, I don't like it when designers' response to criticism is "ok, I'll just delete the offenders." It's usually a better idea to modify what's already there so that it works properly. Removing the offending super koopas would have given the level less of a blatant negative impression, yes, but I think it would still feel as though something's missing. I mean, I doubt you would have pasted them into the level to begin with if they weren't supposed to be a part of it, right?

Originally posted by RedToonLink

I can see why the whole bullet bill shooter thing got a tad annoying for some (namely the judges), but I was sort of going for a Castlevania vibe. It's no use justifying the reasoning behind that, now that judging is over, but I feel like I should at least mention it. I could have executed it in a less repetitive manner, but for what it's worth, it does suit its purpose. Instead of expecting to rush through the level for the sake of getting over with, I feel that the level should be kinder to players that take their time. You can get through Castlevania if you think about your moves rather than hold a direction and mash the jump button, right?

I think the difference between your level and Castlevania is that the latter doesn't have stop-and-go pacing. Yes, you have to plan your moves carefully, but (correct me if I'm wrong) you're always tangoing with enemies in an action-packed setting, not waiting for bullet bills to fire amid cramped architecture. You say the level is kinder to people who take their time, but I did take my time and personally found it more tedious than any Castlevania obstacles I remember going through. Besides, there are plenty of spots where you simply can't take your time because you have to disembark from a falling platform or bounce on note blocks, and it's not uncommon to get hit by bullet bills in those situations whether you're trying to be careful or not. Or at least, that was my take on it. I'm also not sure Castlevania's style of difficulty is a good thing to pursue in SMW, since the health systems are completely different...

Originally posted by xlk

Also, if what I've understood is correct, level design seems to consist on sprite placement and dificulty being hard enough yet posible, yet I doubt a chalenging level with great sprite placement composed of cementblocks would get 20 on level design and 0 on aescetics.

You're creating a false dichotomy there. If those were the only factors I used in my judging, you would have scored much lower. I did take everything into consideration, which is why you scored the way you did. The reason spritework comes up a lot in my comments is because I think it's an area many designers here need to focus on, not because it's the only important factor when making good levels. I'm getting a little tired of the selective perception in this thread. Just because I point out flaws in one area, it doesn't mean I fail to notice good design in other areas; I try to be very holistic when trying to decide how to rank entries.

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Allow me to butt in for one moment.

To everyone whining about your feedback: Shut the fuck up.

I don't care. Feedback is feedback. You don't have to agree with it. You don't have to like it. Feel free to throw it out, even. But dammit, appreciate that you got it at all. Not all creative endeavors have communities willing to organize mass critiques. Some of us have trouble getting feedback at all, and the whining that people "missed the point" is utterly grating.

These people spent a lot of their own personal time FOR YOU. Let me repeat that. THEY DID THIS FOR YOU. And you're yelling at them? Not cool. At all.

To everyone taking their feedback in stride, appreciating it even if they don't agree: You're goddamn awesome. Keep at it, and you'll prove yourself competent if you haven't already.

It's nice that they provide feedback, but some around here think that their feedback is wrong or is the one they didn't expect to get.

Pretty interesting thread... now even George Bush hacks SMW: the 11/09/2001 disaster wasn't enough for him.

But i just wanted to reply something, just because i don't want to escape from anything

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Originally posted by Dinomar

No i'm not complaining because i didn't win a prize (eew i am not even interested on prizes those times), but "some" reviews are just ridicolous that wear the mask of "professional".

Oh do elaborate.

Ok, i'll elaborate, but after quoting something else:

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@Dinomar: Your thinly veiled vitriol and narcissism is not a little disappointing, but I stand by my assessment of the level. It looks fantastic, yes, but I don't think all the different areas you have justify the long overall length, and the spritework isn't very engaging at all. Most of it is grounded walking enemies on flat terrain within corridor-ish areas, which makes the enemies about as challenging as Doom AI. It reminds me of A Boy and His Blob (Wii), which in my opinion has similar issues. Nobody doubts your artistic ability, but if you think your level is nearly perfect compared to all the entries that scored higher than yours, I'd say you're just stubbornly refusing to broaden your horizons.

First of all, i'm saying that because professional reviews don't try to "seek a needle in a haystack". No professional or at least experienced reviewer does that. This is why i say it wears the mask of "professional". Nitpicky doesn't mean professional. And the argument of "multiple subthemes are bad" is invalid, Totally. Who cares? Subthemes count as "appearence", not "level design". So reviews are pretty imprecise, i guess. But keep going on your road. MrDeePay: not my problem: I wanted to give a reasonalbe explanation.

@Axemjinxy: Oh, now i'm a narcisist because i auto-value my own stuff.
And if my level looked fantastic, why did you put a 4 instead of 5 in the appearence field? Or were you just trying to justify your nitpicky review in some way? In your review, just for the sake of pointing out mistakes, you pointed out the anticlimax boss (from SMW, what do you expect, FinalFantasyOver9000's true final boss?), the yoshi egg in the "bonus room" (out of place... just like floating blocks, cowebs underwater, hills with eyes need a logical explanation, eh?), easily avoidable sprites (it was just easy-aimed)... no, in a real review you don't do this. I don't care about your reputation of the expert level designer (even if i don't believe it, being expert in smw's gameplay style doesn't mean being expert in level design), but your argument too is invalid. Also the argument of "first player's point of view" or "go too far from what the original smw looked like" is invalid. heck, even Xkeeper, and the mess he caused in that other discussion, put my level into the best category (5th), so, what does that mean? So, talking about not my level, but about your reviewing method, it's not me that needs to broaden my horizonts, it's you that must do it: the closed-minded way you reviewed my (and i think other's) level proves that. And remember that, even if my level was like you say, you are in a community of schoolers, and most people, here, won't become level designers in future, they don't need to be super perfect designers. You could have been much less harsh with your reviews, but you just looked your way, like horses with blinkers, and didn't even thought people just made this contest only for fun. This addresses also for MrDeePay and his general rudeness towards most people. One open-minded person would have been less harsh and strict with most inexperienced people. And, believe me, even a Mario Team's staff would have been less strict. Being strict doesn't make you professional. So, sorry if this may hit you, but you are not a good reviewer: at all. A good reviewer doesn't point out small pettiness. Yes, he may point out some specific things, but not heavily. So, keep praticting.

Anyway, i'm replying only because we can be in the same position, and so i cannot say i did not reply, i'm not trying to convince anyone because i know i won't be able to do it. Actually, if someone may think i'm getting mad, i am not, i'm calm, but i'm also direct, even if people could not agree at all.
Yes, i replied because i did need to say my thoughs, but basically, i have much better things to think. I didn't win, no matter. Weeabuu is right, people are making a whole deal of it and "mi sono rotto le balle". But let's adding a final note about making a big deal:

Most people, in this constest, just wanted to do what came from their mind, or, more mystically, from their hearts. First, the fact that axemjinx invents the rule that the level must not go far from what the original smw was, well, it wasn't expected. Then, how strict the levels are reviewed... it makes me facepalm on everything. Let's taking Ludus as an example: his entry's flaw was the overdetail and, following "some" logics, went far from the original smw. Ah! We can agree, but basically, he just hoped someone could appreciate the level as it was. we don't need to tell him how to do levels: everyone has his way to do things: someone is not forced to follow axemjinx's way, even in a contest. And it's unfair the fact someone must make a level based on axemjinx's standards. Because in this way, someone cannot be creative, at all. This is the spirit of a creative contest: CREATIVITY! Not preselected standards. So i think this contest failed on it in many points. And not everyone here is going to be a designer. We don't need to be nitpicky.

Now i said everything. Since i'm a very direct person, this post could annoy people, and i don't want to start up dramas, so, if you have anything to clarify with me, just PM me.

tl:dr/moral of the story: My level scoring was pretty unfair, and some judges were strict in general. This, anyway, is not a very big deal, people need to calm down and we just need to be less strict and less nitpicky with stuff mostly made by schoolers.

Really, i feel like repliyng, even if many people i talk with, even in real life, say we shouldn't make a big deal of it: i think there is a reason of why they say that. But, really, i feel like giving my feedbacks anyway. But i also would like people wouldn't change my way to be direct with rudeness. Yes, sometimes i may seem rude, but being offensive in public is the last thing i want to do.

and kaijyuu, who ninjaed me: don't be anticonformist. as judges have the right to give feedback on entries, even who taken part of this contest has the right to give a personal feedback on the result: as you said, feedback is feedback, what is enough is that we just give contents to our feedbacks.

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Originally posted by Ripperon-X

feedback is wrong

Impossible. If someone "missed the point," the artist didn't communicate it well enough.

A point could be made for "non constructive" feedback, but all the feedback I read was constructive. Plenty of "whys." Non-constructive feedback just says "it was good" or "it was bad" and nothing else.

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or is the one they didn't expect to get.

Awesome! If they already knew everything, what the hell good would feedback do?

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and kaijyuu, who ninjaed me: don't be anticonformist. as judges have the right to give feedback on entries, even who taken part of this contest has the right to give a personal feedback on the result: as you said, feedback is feedback, what is enough is that we just give contents to our feedbacks.

That's fine and all, just give respect to those who give you their time and effort.

Yet life goes on...

Even with these sort of feedbacks. Oh well.
Little off-topic: I checked through XKeeper's latest videos and I've noticed soemthing: Did he skip some of the entries by any chance?

Originally posted by AxemJinx

Personally, I don't like it when designers' response to criticism is "ok, I'll just delete the offenders." It's usually a better idea to modify what's already there so that it works properly. Removing the offending super koopas would have given the level less of a blatant negative impression, yes, but I think it would still feel as though something's missing. I mean, I doubt you would have pasted them into the level to begin with if they weren't supposed to be a part of it, right?

I understand that the modification of how much the super koopas interacted with the player would have been the best path to take, but I think I asked that question more as a 'what-if'; I wouldn't want to get rid of the feeling of a contingent of super koopas going through the forest, which doing what I had asked originally would have done. [That may have been why I didn't really mind originally that most of the super koopas didn't really interact with the player; they're doing practice exercises, and still haven't got the hang of being directly on target yet.]
You also mentioned something about it 'still feel[ing] as though something's missing'. I know this is sorta nit-picking, but what was missing from the level? [Or is this not the intended meaning you wanted there?]

harpy

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Referring to Dinomar's post, let me put down some notes:

-The judges weren't nitpicking, they were pointing out flaws that hurt the level design's quality. Easily avoidable sprites, for example, hurt level design because it makes the level too easy.
-Xkeeper liking your hack won't affect the judge's scoring. Different opinions.
-You're not going to do well in a vanilla contest if you're going to do things like put the player in first-person view.
-Why are you singling out axemjinx throughout this? You are ignoring the other two judges, plus you're trying to make your level appeal to all audiences.
-The judges aren't "rude". Just because they don't sugarcoat their reviews doesn't make them rude, it makes them good judges for letting the contestants know all of their problems with their level.

God it's just a level design contest. Why do people keeping taking this personally?

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heck, even Xkeeper, and the mess he caused in that other discussion, put my level into the best category (5th), so, what does that mean?

Whether someone else liked your level or not doesn't necessarily mean that it's good.

Good =/= Like.

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And remember that, even if my level was like you say, you are in a community of schoolers, and most people, here, won't become level designers in future, they don't need to be super perfect designers.You could have been much less harsh with your reviews, but you just looked your way, like horses with blinkers, and didn't even thought people just made this contest only for fun.

We are not here to hold anyone's hands and baby them. As they say, if you can't take the heat, get out the kitchen.

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This addresses also for MrDeePay and his general rudeness towards most people.

You must have a very loose definition of "rude", then.

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One open-minded person would have been less harsh and strict with most inexperienced people.

Leniency caused SMWCP to be what it was. Leniency caused what ASMT to be what it was, and leniency is what's causing A2MT to be what it's shaping to be. Leniency causes potential problems that could've been easily taken care of before it spiraled out of control.

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And, believe me, even a Mario Team's staff would have been less strict.

The standard SMB staff aims for a much, much wider and accessible audience than any ol' SMW hack could ever hope of targeting.

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Being strict doesn't make you professional. So, sorry if this may hit you, but you are not a good reviewer: at all. A good reviewer doesn't point out small pettiness. Yes, he may point out some specific things, but not heavily. So, keep praticting.

I swear, you people keep trying to make these things more personal than they need to be. Some judges to a contest you chose to enter on your own free will didn't think your level was as good as you think it was, that's it, no need to try to hit below the belt.

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Most people, in this constest, just wanted to do what came from their mind, or, more mystically, from their hearts. First, the fact that axemjinx invents the rule that the level must not go far from what the original smw was, well, it wasn't expected.

SMW's engine and gameplay can only go so far before the designer might as well try doing something in a different engine or making their own game. You cannot combine Mega Man's, Sonic's Kirby's, Meat Boy, "Bad Kaizo" Donkey Kong, and so forth's styles into SMW without there being problems. I personally am not on the same page as Axem when it comes to your level's visual appeal, but still.

I also just recently ran through your level again (it was one of the earlier ones I played in the contest), and quite honestly, in addition to my opinion of the design cohesion and it feeling like four levels in one, I should've rated the level design (much) lower than I actually gave it. The spritework, for the most part, isn't as good as it could be and the overall difficulty of the level was very easy. Much like Ludus, it feels like you prioritized visual design over level design.

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Then, how strict the levels are reviewed... it makes me facepalm on everything. Let's taking Ludus as an example: his entry's flaw was the overdetail and, following "some" logics, went far from the original smw. Ah! We can agree, but basically, he just hoped someone could appreciate the level as it was

I can easily appreciate that Ludus' entry looked very nice, yes, but visuals were not the only things we were looking for in the level. It did not play well as it looked.

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Being strict doesn't make you professional. So, sorry if this may hit you, but you are not a good reviewer: at all. A good reviewer doesn't point out small pettiness. Yes, he may point out some specific things, but not heavily. So, keep praticting.

*facepalm* /headdesk/ smh (animecrackle) [ohgod]

Hey Nintendo! Stop being strict on your Mario level consistency! Have a black pole for a Flagpole instead of the consistent white! Mr. President, stop being strict on your job! Mr. Teacher! Stop getting on your students about homework! EVERYBODY STOP BEING STRICT SOMEONE FROM SMWC SAYS BEING STRICT DOESN'T MAKE SOMEONE PROFESSIONAL!

A good reviewer points out EVERYTHING WRONG. Do you actually think that Nintendo doesn't try to find everything wrong in their levels? Do you actually think that they chug out something and call it a day? A cartoonist doesn't chug out things like a toaster, am I right? They look at every detail to see what they have done wrong and have other people to look at it. A writer wants an editor who doesn't feel bad about saying too much things about his/hers constant wrong usage of the word "literally".

A lenient production worker president whatever who does not give a care about the smallest of details because he feels bad to do so is a bad leader, and should be replaced.

MrDeePay worked his butt-off playing NINETY-FIVE levels - half of which makes you want to throw your computer away. If you actually think he did this to make himself look better and put others down, then I don't know what you thin of school and your teachers and your parents - if they don't want to do what they do, then they should still be doing it.

DeePay is a bit harsh at times, and may be disagreeable. But it doesn't take away from the fact that, for the most part, he knows what's he's doing.

I'm sorry, but may be you got TOO used to praises that you became so baffled that you got something really low, and that you got (harsh) constructive criticism for one. (BOY YOU GOT A FAIRLY HIGH SCORE! STOP TRIPPIN' ABOUT IT)

There we're 95 other entries there. As I said before, GOOD LEVEL AREN'T GOING TO CUT IT, YOU NEED TO MAKE MARVELOUS ONES. You might make the most wonderful looking animations and cartoons, but if the story that comes with it is crap, then it would get criticism from all over.

It's like the Lion King with Alvin & the Chipmunks (the live-action movies) storyline - your level might look fantastic, but the way it was used and made was a tad bit disappointing.

Suddenly I understand what it feels like to write reviews for Game Informer magazine and have people write in saying they're unsubscribing because you didn't give x game a high enough score and none of your points are valid. Perhaps I should apply for a position while I'm ahead?

Dinomar, you seem convinced that I'm nitpicking your level, but I actually think the issues I'm bringing up are major ones, not minor details. Clearly you don't feel the same way, and that's fine, but that doesn't make my review invalid. A common thread throughout your reply is basically "your arguments are invalid," but you never explain why.

Originally posted by Dinomar

Oh, now i'm a narcisist because i auto-value my own stuff

No, you're narcissistic because you claimed your level was "nearly perfect" compared to "others you've seen," implying the people who scored higher than you don't deserve their ranks. What did you have to say about the winners? Their levels were "fully functional." High praise, that.

Originally posted by Dinomar

And if my level looked fantastic, why did you put a 4 instead of 5 in the appearence field?

Because the appearance category is more holistic than just pure looks. As I've said, your level puts a whole bunch of themes in one area in such a way that none of them are individually developed very far, and the architecture is very corridor-ish, something I don't personally like because most of the obstacles devolve into the same affair. If you disagree, that's fine, but it would be more convincing for you to explain why you disagree rather than just say "your argument is invalid." The only thing I've heard out of you on that front is that the level is supposed to be easy, but as I've already said, a level can be easy and still have engaging spritework. And yes, I did think your tileset was not in the spirit of the contest this year, which also contributed to me taking off a point, especially in light of how the level actually played.

Originally posted by Dinomar

you pointed out the anticlimax boss (from SMW, what do you expect, FinalFantasyOver9000's true final boss?)

No, I expect you to respect players' time by not putting them through a boss they've essentially already played. There's something to be said for restraint when you don't have the resources you need to make something novel.

Originally posted by Dinomar

the yoshi egg in the "bonus room" (out of place... just like floating blocks, cowebs underwater, hills with eyes need a logical explanation, eh?)

That's not what I mean. It's out of place because you have to give up the Yoshi as soon as you get it. Since when is Yoshi an expendable puzzle element? That sounds a wee bit contrived to me.

Originally posted by Dinomar

in a real review you don't do this

Pray tell, what do you do in a real review besides give an honest opinion and back it up with legitimate reasoning?

Originally posted by Dinomar

your reputation of the expert level designer

Since when do I have that reputation here, specifically? Apart from my/Milk's SMWCP2 level and a mediocre, experimental 24 hour contest entry, when was the last time I designed a level in this community? A few years back...?

Originally posted by Dinomar

being expert in smw's gameplay style doesn't mean being expert in level design

I agree, but then, you don't know anything of my level design experience outside of SMW, do you...?

Originally posted by Dinomar

even Xkeeper, and the mess he caused in that other discussion, put my level into the best category (5th), so, what does that mean?

XKeeper put Lui37's level in the lowest category allegedly because it had a big boo boss, yet put your level in the highest category despite it having a big boo boss. If that's not the epitome of trollish, abrasive inconsistency, I don't know what is. All I can say is that XKeeper has a different perspective than I do, and there's nothing inherently wrong with that, but again, it doesn't make my review invalid.

Originally posted by Dinomar

you are in a community of schoolers, and most people, here, won't become level designers in future, they don't need to be super perfect designers

What does that have to do with the feedback I'm giving in this contest? That's like saying part-time workers don't want performance reviews. From my point of view, it's better to point out everything I don't like about a level, because whether to actually use the feedback is still up to the designer regardless.

Why don't we ask the other entrants? Would you guys rather I didn't mention what I didn't like about your levels? After all, you're just insignificant schoolers, so in-depth feedback won't be of any use to you. Only professional designers are allowed to make competent levels, so sorry. Don't take your own work seriously, because it won't lead to anything down the road. Apathy is the one true path.

Originally posted by Dinomar

First, the fact that axemjinx invents the rule that the level must not go far from what the original smw was, well, it wasn't expected.

Originally posted by Firephoenix

This year we're planning to return the competition to its original roots. Somewhere along the way, the contest lost track of its original purpose: to showcase that level design is the most important aspect of a level.

Originally posted by Firephoenix

Appearance: 5 points

And you think such a stance is unreasonable how...?

Originally posted by Dinomar

someone is not forced to follow axemjinx's way, even in a contest

But see, nobody has to do anything my way because it's up to the designers whether to use any of my feedback to begin with. Also, in case you forgot, there are two other judges besides me for the express purpose of not judging the levels only by my standards.

Originally posted by Dinomar

This is the spirit of a creative contest: CREATIVITY! Not preselected standards.

I hereby give every entry a full score because everyone made the level they wanted to make. It doesn't matter how well a concept is executed, so long as it's creative. Hell, while we're at it, let's just not have judges at all, because nobody wants to improve or hear others' candid opinions. We'll just have a smattering of unorganized community feedback saying things along the lines of "hey, that's pretty cool. good job" and "whoa, creative idea there."

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Originally posted by Feenicks

You also mentioned something about it 'still feel[ing] as though something's missing'. I know this is sorta nit-picking, but what was missing from the level? [Or is this not the intended meaning you wanted there?]

I just meant that it might feel emtpy without those super koopas, is all- they give the level a sense of activity regardless of how directly/indirectly they interact with Mario. I agree that the "contingent of practicing super koopas" feeling is a nice touch and not something you want to get rid of.

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Originally posted by Derpy Blackslide

God it's just a level design contest. Why do people keeping taking this personally?

Maybe some of the level designers felt like their level is going to get ranked rather high due of all the praised it got. However, when they got to see the results, they were left with disappointment.

I'm able to admit, it's emotionally hard to see something that I work on for hours and see it didn't achieved the high standards I had set for it, but that's part of life. Their are going to be people out there that will disagree with you, but you are not doing yourself a favor if you don't listen to them. Take their advice into consideration, and even though you may not agree with them, you be able to do achieve greatness.

Even though I was somewhat disappoint of were my level rank, I had a fun time making my level for the contest and I hope you guys did to.

Originally posted by notgoodwithusernames

Their are going to be people out there that will disagree with you, but you are not doing yourself a favor if you don't listen to them.

I don't understand, if you don't agree with a word they're saying, then why exactly would you listen to it?

I didn't expect my level to rank as low as it did, but when I read the review I understood why, I agree with the points given. Do you see what I mean? I don't think it's just a fundamental difference of opinion.

At my university we have a vision, it goes like this: The bachelor and master students that thinks they are finally done learning when leaving our grounds, they are the ones that got most left to learn, together with everyone else. We never stop learing.

heh, I'm really bad at translating norwegian into english, but I hope you get the point here. The thing is; no matter how good, secure, confident etc. you feel about your choices, oppinions etc., you'll never be fully able to know how you (in this case your creations) turn out amogst all people in the subjective world.

the ones of you that does't appriciate and rather deny what the judges has suggested for you, you got alot more to learn it seems. Imagine you were to be a super famous hacker that got the same feedbacks, but still you should taken their suggestions into consideration, since their feedback is valuable subjective feedback. and according to one of my co-students, there is no such thing as a objective feedback, so I guess you'll have to go to the end of the world to get that.

We should be glad to have staff that arrange this contest every year and judges that has the motivation to write 50 pages+ long documents to actually educate us. there is just so much else they could spend that time on, so don't bash them with classic whining.

Originally posted by Ripperon-X

Little off-topic: I checked through XKeeper's latest videos and I've noticed soemthing: Did he skip some of the entries by any chance?

Xkeeper (lowercase K) says: "I originally did about 60% of the hacks in patch filename order, got tired of it, and then did the top-10 ranked hacks (in order from #1 to #10)."

Originally posted by BMF54123

Woo, 10th place! To be honest, I actually expected to place lower, given the level's short length and lack of difficulty.

Heh, really? Nearly everyone else (myself included) actually expected you to come in first place. I honestly thought your level was interesting. As I stated in the discussion thread, I really liked your effects with the colored lights. That was really interesting!

<Adam> I feel like smwc is a prostitute now, because we put up a porn ad for money

The reason(probably) for most of the level's designerss' complaints is because they aren't profesinals at level design, so they have to put lots of efort into something that latter is given a low score compared to the efort, while others make levels whith utter ease and get a good ranking.This may not be an excuse, but it is a reason.

Also, an idea:why not have these contest have categories(with badges) and a general ranking(prizes) instead of one only final score?That way, people can do great aescetics, great level design, or whatever, and see how they compare to others.

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You do realize this is the "Level Design Competition".

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Originally posted by leod

You do realize this is the "Level Design Competition".

:S would I even be here now If I didn't know what the contest was about?I don't think so.
Also

Originally posted by axemjinx

Originally posted by xlk

Also, if what I've understood is correct, level design seems to consist on sprite placement and dificulty being hard enough yet posible, yet I doubt a chalenging level with great sprite placement composed of cementblocks would get 20 on level design and 0 on aescetics.

You're creating a false dichotomy there. The reason spritework comes up a lot in my comments is because I think it's an area many designers here need to focus on, not because it's the only important factor when making good levels. I'm getting a little tired of the selective perception in this thread. Just because I point out flaws in one area, it doesn't mean I fail to notice good design in other areas; I try to be very holistic when trying to decide how to rank entries.

thats my answer to "level design", level design literally means everything in a level's design, wich includes other stuff other than playability, wich is what most people asociate level design to.

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