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Beta Testing SMWCP2
Forum Index - Events - Super Mario World Central Production 2 Completion Project - SMWCP2 Archive - Beta Testing SMWCP2
Pages: « 1 2 »
I know that this may sound a little extreme, but I think if anyone here is actually serious about producing a GREAT and HIGH QUALITY game. Before you guys actually officially release SMWCP2, this is what I think you guys should do.

When the game is just about finished do a sample release to a small group of 5 or 10 people for the sole purpose of gaining valuable feedback from them before releasing the final version of the game to the public.

So why do this? What am I talking about? Am I nuts?

No. I'm not nuts, if you guys are serious about this game, what you do is select a small group of people, who are OUTSIDE of the SMWC hacking community and you give them your pretty much final version of the game to test play.

You ask them to play the game all the way through without cheats, saves states, tools, ect and you ask them to make a screen recording of their entire play-through. You also ask them to have a mic enabled, so you can hear them talk and ask them to give feedback during their entire game playing experience. When they have finished the game they are also asked to e-mail that video to someone in charge of this at SMWC.

The main designers/decision makers of SMWCP2 then watch all of these play-throughs, and they study and take note of the feedback from what the players said.

This way you can see a glimpse of how the game will be played and how well it will be received when you release it publicly.

For example. Lets say that pretty much everyone who tested out the game thought that level 5 was just totally unfair. Well then, before releasing the final game go back and adjust level 5 so that it no longer feels unfair.

Another example: Say your watching someones play-through and they get frustrated on the over-world map just shout out "How come there are no directional arrows that tell you what paths you can take?" Well then, before releasing the final version of the game, go ahead and add in those directional arrows.

Actually companies do this all the time whenever they are releasing new products. A company which makes potatoes chips will be wanting to release a new flavor of chip on the market. So they get a bunch of taste tasters who come in and sample the different flavored chips and ask them which ones they liked the best.

Just think if a car company designed a new model car, but then never bothered to give it a test drive and then released it out on the market. How well do you think that's going to go? This is why whenever you make something, you test it out and evaluate the results and then make any changes if necessary.

Now I'm sure that you guys already have beta testers right? But I don't necessarily think that just having beta testers does the job. Correct me if I'm wrong, but SMWCP1 was beta tested right? But look how negatively it was received for its unfairness in difficulty by the public. Having beta testers is good, but I think having regular people play the game too while giving their feedback is better.

Also, please make sure that I'm included in the list of beta testers for SMWCP2. Believe it or not, I actually care about this project and would like to see a great game as the final result. Thanks.

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You ask them to play the game all the way through without cheats, saves states, tools, ect and you ask them to make a screen recording of their entire play-through. You also ask them to have a mic enabled, so you can hear them talk and ask them to give feedback during their entire game playing experience. When they have finished the game they are also asked to e-mail that video to someone in charge of this at SMWC.


Not a bad idea in theory, but the tough part is finding someone who would want to sit down and offer recorded feedback on every single level. What would be more wise is to take two groups of people - one which has experience with playing hacks but nothing to do with the project, and the other which has very little experience with hacks AND very little to do with the project. This would give a sense of both ends of the spectrum of how hard the hack is, for both veterans and novices alike.

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but SMWCP1 was beta tested right?


It wasn't tested well. This is partially the testers' fault since a lot of them used save states, and partially my fault since I didn't give them enough time.


Also, your post kind of implies that I wasn't planning on setting up beta testers for this project anyway. Believe me, I have plans for the beta testing phase already. It's going to take as long as we need it to take to create a high quality product.
Originally posted by S.N.N.
Believe me, I have plans for the beta testing phase already. It's going to take as long as we need it to take to create a high quality product.


I hope that you include me as a beta tester as well.

I know sometimes I may sound like I'm just bashing SMCP1, but in reality that was a hack that I was highly anticipating and when I finally played it, I felt totally let down. I have a huge appreciation for high quality hacks and I don't want the same thing to happen to SMWCP2.

For example just minutes after making my last post I started watching another lets play video of SMWC1. You can view the video here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hfRWMY-FwT0]

Just literally seconds after the person enters their first level, Toad Town they say that they are disappointed because you can't enter into some of the doors. Then they are confused about who all the characters are in the Toad Town Bar. Then the guy says that hes loosing faith in this hack when hes only just started.

You NEVER want this to happen when releasing a game!

The goal is for people to LIKE your game.

So please make sure the game is properly beta tested and do a small sample release of this game to a small group of everyday players an order to gain feedback to make sure that SMWCP2 will be well received for its final release to the public. Thanks.

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Originally posted by ClearYoshi
Originally posted by S.N.N.
Believe me, I have plans for the beta testing phase already. It's going to take as long as we need it to take to create a high quality product.


I hope that you include me as a beta tester as well.


Uhm...to be nice, beta testers are everybody. There might be specific ones, but essentially, it's everybody. SNN already said it, but testing is, all in all, the main thing we have going here in SMWCP2. Hell - past items approved are still being tested,

To not beat around the bush, the example you used is horrible. And isn't a problem with the hack, but the people who are playing it.
Originally posted by Giant Shy Guy
Originally posted by ClearYoshi
Originally posted by S.N.N.
Believe me, I have plans for the beta testing phase already. It's going to take as long as we need it to take to create a high quality product.


I hope that you include me as a beta tester as well.


Uhm...to be nice, beta testers are everybody. There might be specific ones, but essentially, it's everybody. SNN already said it, but testing is, all in all, the main thing we have going here in SMWCP2. Hell - past items approved are still being tested,

To not beat around the bush, the example you used is horrible. And isn't a problem with the hack, but the people who are playing it.


Well, I guess I'll be beta testing it then. Thanks.

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Extras



I should have something witty to put here (even if it's just to update dated info), shouldn't I?

Advertising Space

Beta testing apps don't work that way.

If we want people unfamiliar with SMW hacking to beta test, I can probably gather a couple of people. I have a few people who've known me to be a hacker for a while. They're gamers but don't actively hack themselves.
SMWC's official dentist since 2011.

YouTube - Twitter - Twitch
I'd be willing to beta-test, but you don't have to add me to the list if you don't want to.

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Vanilla Twist!
Originally posted by MVS
If we want people unfamiliar with SMW hacking to beta test, I can probably gather a couple of people. I have a few people who've known me to be a hacker for a while. They're gamers but don't actively hack themselves.


Yeah, thanks. It's really just my suggestion to SNN, Lightvayne and the other people in charge of the hack.

I reason why I suggested that people outside of the SMWC hacking community test play the game is because, well lets face it, yes most if not all of the members here will be playing it, but there will also be tons of people outside of SMWC that are going to be playing it too. This hack is going to be BIG right? Well, then its going to have to then appeal to a greater/wider audience and you need feedback from that audience an order to see how well they like the game.

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Well, you just can't appeal everyone. There'll always be that annoying group of people who were always skeptical about this project and will be very nitpicky and will find anything to say the hack is bad/terrible/OMG WTF DID I JUS PLAY!!1!11/whatever, some annoying guys who like to bash everything just to let everyone who worked on it down, or also some guys who don't exactly understand what SMW hacking (or level design, for that matter) is and are always expecting something ultra !11EPICZ!1!1! in every single level they play (though, I believe most of them will be stupid youtube users, but still).


But that doesn't mean I don't like your idea, I find it pretty clever, actually (but I think S.N.N. already thought about [and was intending to do] that before you made this thread), but the point is that no matter how much testing we will go through to make this really really polished, there'll always be someone that was not impressed (and will most likely shout that to everyone on the net).


E: That guy on the video you linked is a fine example of this, he's just playing the hack to complain, not to have fun.

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Originally posted by ClearYoshi
Originally posted by MVS
If we want people unfamiliar with SMW hacking to beta test, I can probably gather a couple of people. I have a few people who've known me to be a hacker for a while. They're gamers but don't actively hack themselves.


Yeah, thanks. It's really just my suggestion to SNN, Lightvayne and the other people in charge of the hack.

I thought it was quite clear that my comment was directed at the project leaders.
SMWC's official dentist since 2011.

YouTube - Twitter - Twitch
Originally posted by Magiluigi
But that doesn't mean I don't like your idea, I find it pretty clever, actually (but I think S.N.N. already thought about [and was intending to do] that before you made this thread)


Thank you. Yes, and I'm sure S.N.N. thought of it too since he's a pretty smart guy.


Originally posted by Magiluigi
but the point is that no matter how much testing we will go through to make this really really polished, there'll always be someone that was not impressed.


Inevitability this is true, simply for the fact that people like to complain about something no matter what.

Also, instead of having the testers e-mail their screen recorded game play to someone at SMWC, they could just upload it to youtube and select private and provide a link. This way anyone who wants to contribute to part of the beta testing process at SMWC could all just simply join together in a chat room and everyone just hits play on the youtube video at the same time so everyone watches the video and can comment on it in real time.

It would just be like watching a lets play on youtube.

Now, I know that I've been talking a lot about this beta testing idea process and all and maybe some of you might think I'm going overboard, but just let me say this.

If you guys care enough about a project to spend years developing it and to spend hundreds of hours of hard work on it. Then wouldn't you also want to make sure that it also gets properly beta tested?

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Ehm Hello. I'm new here .

Sooo I want too help somehow, but i'm not a good creator for levels. I have only some experience with the overworld. Then I think i could act as a beta tester.
I played your first hack. The difficulty was a bit too high, since the second half of the second world I was so frustrated that I used save states for the rest.

I think that I'm not a really good mario gamer. But I have big expectations in this hack. It#s soo beautifull in look, so lets make it also beautfull in game play.

My first results: I play this hacks without savestates, only one in the beginning!
-Girder Grasslands: A very good level in the beginning

-plateau pumps: All in all a good level. Only the lakitu are annoying. And in one area the koopa who throw hammers doesn't spawn. Maybo to many enemies?

-Hiker's Hollow: Good level

-Smoggy steppe: Good level.

-Switch scamber: All in all, a good level.

But the end is a bit frustrating. Because the p-switch part don't allow the smallest mistake, or you fall down. In my opinion it is unfair, please extend the ground so we player don't die, but can use the reset door and try it again without loose a life.

Here you can see what I mean.


- velocity valves: I can't end this level. I don't get it, how I can fly so long to reach the goal????? And the framerate x(. Oh god, please less enemies, the game slowed down so much. Everywhere...

Edit: I got it, just hold b.. jeah... I end the level

-Reclaimed refinery: It is hard but possible without save states. The same problem like velocity valves. Sometimes the game slowed down.

-countdown chamber: After loose or beating the clock, the music stops, also the switch don't worked.....

-Fringe forest: A beautifull level. I like the idea and everything worked.




So thats it, I try too help so much I can. Sorry for my english I, m german . Oh and one question, how I can make pictures, so you can see what I mean

Edit:I mostly conzentrate at the dificulty now, because with the bugs it would too much pictures and axplanations. For that we have some other beta testers I think :P.

mfG DundG

Originally posted by DundG
Oh and one question, how I can make pictures, so you can see what I mean :D.

mfG DundG


Depends on the emulator. ZSNES is F1, in BSNES its "Tools > Capture Screenshot" (there is a quick button for this, though I don't remember off hand what it is. And I don't recall what it was for SNES9x.
Layout by LDA during C3.
And if you need somewhere to upload the image, consider your File Bin or a hosting site like photobucket.

(By the way, signing with "MfG" probably won't be understood since it's English speakers you're talking to.)

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Thanks. I edit them. If there are some questions I try to explain it better or add some more screenshots.

Originally posted by DundG

-plateau pumps: All in all a good level. Only the lakitu are annoying. And in one area the koopa who throw hammers doesn't spawn. Maybo to many enemies?

It didn't have the correct sprite memory setting. It's now fixed

Originally posted by DundG

-Switch scamber: All in all, a good level.

But the end is a bit frustrating. Because the p-switch part don't allow the smallest mistake, or you fall down. In my opinion it is unfair, please extend the ground so we player don't die, but can use the reset door and try it again without loose a life.

Here you can see what I mean.
I will agree that death is a bit harsh for a penalty this early on in the game. I'll make some adjustments, and notify AnybodyAgrees if he wants a different setup.
Layout by LDA during C3.
woow, after fringe forest the difficultly rise fast. If you guys could play this levels without many tries then you have skill. I slightly frustrated to them wirhout states. Also I bored a little because I tried the same levels so many times. I see everything again and again and again....

-Treetop tussle: first the top. I tried to jump at the higher line of blocks, but i couldn't jump high enough. The ceiling disturb the jump and you fall down. The normal player wouldn't know that, so it is a bit unfair, with the wtf what happened effect #w{|o}



Also I don't know if it looks really good with the piranha plant bottom side behind the floating island:


This piranha plant doesn't work the fire who are spit by the plant disapear in the top....


also mario head stick onto the ceiling an i kann slightly walk on it, it is a glitch x)







-Manic mine: I think thies enemy shouldn't have this color or? And I think this playce is a bit unfair, you can dodge it, but I died so many times.. I haven't fun in this level.


also there:


and the tripple wagon is like it is made of ice, you slide on them....










Huh, wow so many things that I would change, I hope that can help with this stuff.


Currently feedback
:
Without savestates the game is possible, but I haven't really fun with it, because for me it is too hard to enjoy the levels since manic mine (I played I thing five levels further too...). And I was just in the forest area..... I wouldn't say that im bad... its just sometimes the enemies are really "unfair" placed, also sometimes there are to many. I couldn't focused ad one koopa, because there are chucks and goombas so the koopa killed me (it is just an example) Also I think the levels are too long for a difficultly like this, I die and should go through all the stuff again? And then there are "traps" who can ruine your entire run in a level. Just like in the manic mine: A really outraged when the coopa killed me with the shell. I haven't enough time to realize this attack for the first time and after the koopa a chuk jumped into my face, so I died again. And then i realized "God this is just the half?????". And I think the levels will be harder.... The result is clear: A game with beautifull graphigs and more beautifully music (I love your compositions) but only a game for smw hack "freaks" (I didn't mean this negative) who have enough skill to win the game without savestates. I wouldn't play this hack without states when I just waited for the release in this state. Secondly I see always the same power ups: I get a Mushroom then a flower..... Who are the feather? When the feather are too usefull then nerve it. Make it like the leaf in super mario brothers.

Too hard for levels in this lenghts. One suggestiion. Put many middle points in one level, this could fix it. I always say they are possible but really hard and long....
Originally posted by DundG

-Treetop tussle: first the top. I tried to jump at the higher line of blocks, but i couldn't jump high enough. The ceiling disturb the jump and you fall down. The normal player wouldn't know that, so it is a bit unfair, with the wtf what happened effect #w{|o}




Yeah, DundG. I think that same thing happened to me too. You hit your head on the ceiling and you fall down without really knowing what happened.

It's good to see people like you DundG giving feedback like this.

-Final
The icy mine cart bug is actually a bug in SMW itself, yes, it's annoying, but I don't really think it can be fixed >_>

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Forum Index - Events - Super Mario World Central Production 2 Completion Project - SMWCP2 Archive - Beta Testing SMWCP2

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