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Level 10 (World 2) - Swampland Passage (complete...ish, we still need a new BG)
Forum Index - Sunken Ghost Ship - Old Contests & Events - SMW Central Production 1.5 - Level 10 (World 2) - Swampland Passage (complete...ish, we still need a new BG)
Pages: « 1 » Link
Well, after finishing Nippy Expanse, I wanted to move on to something that would be easier to fix up. This level is actually pretty good, there's just a few minor things that need to be changed.

1. We need to fix up the music. The biggest complaint that people have about this level is that the Touhou song just doesn't fit the overall level. At this point, I've combed through the music section and have found four potential candidates. If anyone has any other ideas for a song, please don't hesitate to let me know!

Sonic the Hedgehog (8-bit) - Jungle Zone

Seiekn Densetsu 3 - Powell

New Super Mario Bros. Wii - Jungle

Mario Kart DS - Yoshi Falls

2. See the water here?



It's not pretty. The surface blatantly clashes with the actual water tiles. I was thinking of just converting the transparent tiles to normal water tiles, but if there are surface tiles that match the transparent tiles, could someone please let me know? I'd love to use matching surface tiles.

3. I feel like the level is kinda empty at some parts. I'm thinking of possibly adding in some sprites to make it a little more exciting.

So, there's my plan for fixing up this level. As you can probably tell, the biggest issues that this level has are aesthetic ones. The level design is already pretty good and doesn't need a lot of change.

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Mario's Vanilla Journey

Progress: 22/72 levels complete
I like Jungle Zone the most for this stage, but all of them work better than the Touhou theme. Powell sounds a bit repetitive at the beginning, though.

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Here are some surface tiles that match. However, they still clash because of the sudden transition from forest to rocks. Turns out the original water surface tiles were there to mask that fact.
Why don't we just replace the background? It's from YI and looks kind of lame anyway. Surely we have something better.
It sounds like that would be the best option. I'll go make a request in the graphics thread for a new background.

In the meantime, I've prepared an IPS so that you can see all the level design changes that I've made. I actually didn't change a ton of stuff regarding level design. Just be sure to ignore every graphical issue you see, because that's going to be fixed later.

List of Changes

- Added some sprites to make the level feel less empty
- Removed as many cement blocks as possible
-Changed the positions of some fish so that there's no Big Mario discrimination

Download IPS Here (outdated link)

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Mario's Vanilla Journey

Progress: 22/72 levels complete
Yeah, the background is sore on the eyes when combined with the foreground. In fact, I'd replace the foreground with either the new grassland set being developed or some other suitable graphical set, so it doesn't look too different from the water and so it just looks better. If you don't change the graphics, I think a new palette is in order; the grass doesn't look natural and is harsh on the eyes.

Because I'm biased I'd suggest using the NSMBW jungle theme, just because I like that theme :v

- BlackMageMario
--I'm getting a lot of slowdown that wasn't there before at (1) the first high-low area, (2) the two wigglers at the subsequent yoshi coin, and sometimes (3) the long row of throw blocks. It might just be on my end, but otherwise I'd reposition / remove some enemies.
--Also about that first high-low area: Get rid of the upper right flopping fish, because if it falls down the chute to the right, it turns into a dangerous blind drop, and you have to backtrack to the left and go under to play it safe. In addition, get rid of that bit of ground that's on the bottom row of tiles. It's misleading.
--Consider replacing the surface hopping fish with the ones that go back and forth and jump, so it doesn't look awkward when they run out of water to swim in.
--Consider raising the ceiling during the long row of throw blocks and at the last wiggler enemy, as well as right after the first high-low area. I'm not convinced a world 2 level should be relying on low ceilings so much.
--Remove the cave goal room at the end. Since we're relocating the sewer levels, we longer need that transition.

I don't know, I guess there are a bunch of little things I don't like about this stage.

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Originally posted by AxemJinx
--I'm getting a lot of slowdown that wasn't there before at (1) the first high-low area, (2) the two wigglers at the subsequent yoshi coin, and sometimes (3) the long row of throw blocks. It might just be on my end, but otherwise I'd reposition / remove some enemies.


I didn't experience any of the slowdown, but I went and respositioned/removed some sprites just in case.

Originally posted by AxemJinx
--Also about that first high-low area: Get rid of the upper right flopping fish, because if it falls down the chute to the right, it turns into a dangerous blind drop, and you have to backtrack to the left and go under to play it safe. In addition, get rid of that bit of ground that's on the bottom row of tiles. It's misleading.
--Consider replacing the surface hopping fish with the ones that go back and forth and jump, so it doesn't look awkward when they run out of water to swim in.
--Consider raising the ceiling during the long row of throw blocks and at the last wiggler enemy, as well as right after the first high-low area. I'm not convinced a world 2 level should be relying on low ceilings so much.


All of these issues have been fixed.

Originally posted by AxemJinx
--Remove the cave goal room at the end. Since we're relocating the sewer levels, we longer need that transition.


Unfortunately, the reason that the room exists in the first place is because the goal post graphics are glitched in this level for some reason. I'll try and turn the final room into a swampy cave though so that the level doesn't seem to be transitioning into a sewer.

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Mario's Vanilla Journey

Progress: 22/72 levels complete
Originally posted by akacesfan
Originally posted by AxemJinx
--Remove the cave goal room at the end. Since we're relocating the sewer levels, we longer need that transition.


Unfortunately, the reason that the room exists in the first place is because the goal post graphics are glitched in this level for some reason. I'll try and turn the final room into a swampy cave though so that the level doesn't seem to be transitioning into a sewer.

That's probably because the level isn't using GFX17 in the FG2 slot. The fastest way to address that is to load GFX17 into BG2 or BG3, then re-create the goal tape tiles in Map16. It should only take up four tiles. Be sure to send those updated Map16 tiles to S.N.N. along with the level, and make sure you aren't overwriting any recent Map16 changes due to things like level optimization (example).

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I may eventually make you a background, but don't expect it any time soon. Just worry about fixing other stuff, first. :)
Thanks a ton Mineyl!

I'm fixing up the water tiles right now. That's probably the last thing that I can do with the level until a BG gets made.

In the meantime, I've put out another IPS that fixes all of the stuff that AxemJinx mentioned.

List of Changes

- Small sprite changes (too many to list)
- Actual goal point added
- I fixed the water to make it look less ugly, but there's a catch. The original SMW water creates major cutoff with corner tiles. Unfortunately, the only solution for now was to replace those corner tiles with cement blocks. It's not ideal, but it's a good stopgap solution for now.

DOWNLOAD HERE

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Mario's Vanilla Journey

Progress: 22/72 levels complete
A few other graphical notes:

--I don't know if the original level had this problem too, but the pipe ends on the upside-down pipes are incorrect; they have to be y-flipped, like the one on Map16 page 3D. We might want to redraw the pipe ends globally so they can be used in either direction...
--The powerup from the block in that first pool of water at the beginning won't display properly until it's fully out of the block. Part of me wants to simplify this pool into a shallower one without a powerup block, since there's another powerup just a few screens down, but I'm not sure.
--The one problem with using cement blocks as underwater ground corner tiles is that they cut off the contours of the actual ground tiles. It wouldn't be hard to draw the water-compatible tiles yourself, since it's just a matter of duplicating the standard ground corner 8*8 with a different background color.


Ugh, this level is such a graphical mess. Seriously.

You know what? I looked through the graphics files filling up the FG2 and BG1 slots, and I think they just contain that background we're probably going to trash for this level anyway. Delete those Map16 tiles for the goal tape. Just restore the defaults for FG2 (17) and BG1 (1B), use one of the original backgrounds for now, and paste the goal tape tiles like you normally would.

As for ground corner tiles that are compatible with water, all you need is a single 8*8 tile in an ExGFX file, a single palette color in the same row as the ground tiles, and a bit of Map16 space. Use the 8*8 tile to duplicate the standard ground corner, but make the background color the same as water, then create all the Map16 tiles you need with that. I don't think any other levels use ExGFX 8E, so you could probably safely overwrite something that this level doesn't use, like the monty mole hole.

Of course, somewhere down the line we could just make a new FG tileset as well, but it would need to have those water-compatible tiles built in.

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I was able to fix the water issue (thank goodness). Thanks a ton AxemJinx! I also followed the suggestion about the first pool, but for now, I'm leaving the pipes as they are because I'm assuming they'll be eventually redrawn.

Anyways, I'm going to send everything off to SNN. Thanks a ton for your help everyone, because this level was an absolute nightmare to fix up.

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Mario's Vanilla Journey

Progress: 22/72 levels complete
It's still not fixed. While playing the level, I found that some of the wiggler sprites are messed up. Take this one for example.



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Vanilla Twist!
Incidentally, the original version of the level uses custom sprites (18 x2) for the wigglers. I wonder if there's a reason to stick to those over the tileset specific version? It may be worth reverting to the custom ones to see if it eliminates that issue.

Edit: Never mind, apparently those are even more glitched up.

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I came across that issue when I was fixing the slowdown. I removed some sprites and never came across that issue again, but for whatever reason, I guess it's not fixed. It must be a bug of some sort.

The custom sprites were even glitchier than the normal wigglers. Their graphics were badly screwed up. I never got a picture, but half the time, they wouldn't even appear. The other half of the time, their graphics were an awful glitchy mess.

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Mario's Vanilla Journey

Progress: 22/72 levels complete
Don't know if you saw my last edit, so I'm reposting, but try reverting to GFX 2 in the SP4 slot. I have no idea what that ExGFX file is doing there, and I'm beginning to wonder if it's even necessary.

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I think I may have figured out the issue. The sprite memory in the level is 10, and I think (I'm not 100% sure) that SNN may have removed the No More Sprite Tile Limits patch. That may be the cause of our issues.

I'm using GFX 2 in SP4 already.

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Mario's Vanilla Journey

Progress: 22/72 levels complete
Pages: « 1 » Link
Forum Index - Sunken Ghost Ship - Old Contests & Events - SMW Central Production 1.5 - Level 10 (World 2) - Swampland Passage (complete...ish, we still need a new BG)

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