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Which Super Mario 64 Hacks work with Everdrive 64?

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Read in another thread that they are now playable, but not all. Which SM64 hacks are actually playable on an Everdrive 64? And where can I find patches that make them work on ED64?
I read somewhere that the rom/ram loads need to be aligned properly for the hacks work on real hardware. I'm not sure which hacks are like that.

Quote
And where can I find patches that make them work on ED64?


Unfortunately it wouldn't be that simple.


This is the best post
In a nutshell, NO Hacks work on Everdrive except the Super Mario 64 Multiplayer 1.2, I have once tested it, probably because the ROM is still 8MB and there is no need to change the RDRAM size.
Originally posted by Mr. GreenThunder
In a nutshell, NO Hacks work on Everdrive except the Super Mario 64 Multiplayer 1.2, I have once tested it, probably because the ROM is still 8MB and there is no need to change the RDRAM size.


Wrong. According to this source, it seems to be possible to work around the ram expansion. However, most hacks will lag inevitably; Return to Retroland being a counterexample, since I didn't shove too many polygons into the levels. I'm very unaware as to why the EverDrive64 loaded the textures from the underground level and not the others.. Very strange.
Originally posted by Some source
if it isn't 64MB and higher, you are in luck and the hack will most likely work.

Do you not know hacks are now expanded by 114MB?
Originally posted by Mr. GreenThunder
Originally posted by Some source
if it isn't 64MB and higher, you are in luck and the hack will most likely work.

Do you not know hacks are now expanded by 114MB?


Could you please stop spreading around so much misinformation? ROMs are still expanded to 64MB after the use of the expansion tool and there currently is no valid reason to expand the ROM even further. I won't believe you this nonsense unless you can provide some sources which prove that ROMs are now expanded to 114MB. I'm sorry for being too rude on this, but really. You can't just tell something to be true without showing some sources.

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Originally posted by Mr. GreenThunder
Originally posted by Some source
if it isn't 64MB and higher, you are in luck and the hack will most likely work.

Do you not know hacks are now expanded by 114MB?

wot m8? I'm pretty sure that 64MB is the maximum size that an N64 will address. And 114MB isn't a multiple of 8mb.

edit

Originally posted by cpuHacka101
Wrong. According to this source,

That's actually pretty interesting. It probably wouldn't be too hard to make a little tool that moves all of the files and then remap the pointers (however that might create problems for some of the more complex hacks). Or, to get rid of the problem from the source, an alternate decompressor could be made, and then a different mode for the alternate extended ROM could be added to TT64/other tools.


nother edit

I think this 'one-byte-off' thing is also why Nemu doesn't like vl-tone's rom. I did a little experiment with changing one of the pointers in BoB's level script to point to an uncompressed version of one of the MIO0 files, and the level loaded fine in Nemu, no crashes or glitches


This is the best post
When you apply the RCVI hack in the importer that's when it gets expanded to 128 or 114MB (I think it's 128)
Currently working on:
Super Mario: Through New Worlds
Crossover game with a bunch of levels from other games.
http://www.smwcentral.net/?p=viewthread&t=74033
Check out my Youtube Channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/toxicplaysnintendo
I can test peoples hacks for glitches, just send me a PM.
Originally posted by IllumiNavi
When you apply the RCVI hack in the importer that's when it gets expanded to 128 or 114MB (I think it's 128)


No, it doesn't. I've just tried it and my ROM still is 64MB big. Like I've told already: It's a misinformation and NOT true. There's no reason to expand the ROM further than 64MB.

Pics:


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Ok, I guess there aren't any SM64 Hacks larger than 64MB normally.
Currently working on:
Super Mario: Through New Worlds
Crossover game with a bunch of levels from other games.
http://www.smwcentral.net/?p=viewthread&t=74033
Check out my Youtube Channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/toxicplaysnintendo
I can test peoples hacks for glitches, just send me a PM.
Originally posted by Tarek701
Originally posted by Mr. GreenThunder
Originally posted by Some source
if it isn't 64MB and higher, you are in luck and the hack will most likely work.

Do you not know hacks are now expanded by 114MB?


Could you please stop spreading around so much misinformation? ROMs are still expanded to 64MB after the use of the expansion tool and there currently is no valid reason to expand the ROM even further. I won't believe you this nonsense unless you can provide some sources which prove that ROMs are now expanded to 114MB. I'm sorry for being too rude on this, but really. You can't just tell something to be true without showing some sources.

Don't say what you don't know man + still being cocky when you are wrong, current ROM hacks are now expanded to 114MB especially when you want to do AREAL importing and expand RAM banks w/ Level scripts.
And If you want proof, here, my hack.
Originally posted by Mr. GreenThunder

Don't say what you don't know man + still being cocky when you are wrong, current ROM hacks are now expanded to 114MB especially when you want to do AREAL importing and expand RAM banks w/ Level scripts.
And If you want proof, here, my hack.


First off, no need to get offensive now. No one is being cocky here and you shouldn't go over the red line. It won't get you anywhere but just into deep trouble. I have a very good knowledge about how the N64 and the game works(including the work of MIPS CPU, RCP(and the RCPBlocks, etc) and studied it a very long time, starting from 2006. (8 or 9 Years now) I've uploaded the whole N64DevKit a while ago, where I learned the most stuff about the N64: http://n64devkit.square7.ch/

Back to Topic:
You answered my question, but only half. It's still not clear enough to me. I just see only your hack expanded by 114MB. So, your phrase is still contradictory and makes no sense: "current ROM hacks" and "Do you not know hacks are now expanded by 114MB?". Please enlighten me on this. You're basically saying that every hack is expanded by 114MB by default, which is not the case, because every hack is only expanded by 65MB.

You may list me a significant amount of hacks which are now expanded by 114MB and eventually (in case it exists) the tool which was used to expand the ROM to 114MB. And by significant I don't mean only 1 or 2 hacks. By significant I mean a big amount of people doing this currently which covers around the half of the community. Anything else is not "default" in my eyes and goes more to category: "Exceptional".

If you can't, then I please you to correct your phrases("Do you not know hacks are now expanded by 114MB" to "And what about ROMs, like mine, which is 114MB big?" and "current ROM hacks" to "my ROM hack"). I'm aware of that someone might want to need more space and eventually expand it to 114MB, but you're talking like if it's already a default thing and everyone does it, which clearly IS NOT the case.

To the beginners which E-mail spammed me after Cackletta's successful attempt of confusing anyone:

By default every ROM is expanded to 64MB and not more. You are able to expand even further(by hand or by using a different expansion tool), but you obviously don't need to do this if you want to create a great hack. (For proof, see Skelux's hack. One of the best hacks out there)

Greetings,
Tarek701.

My Mail | My Posts | PM Me | My YT Channel | My Blog
Originally posted by Tarek701
Originally posted by Mr. GreenThunder

Don't say what you don't know man + still being cocky when you are wrong, current ROM hacks are now expanded to 114MB especially when you want to do AREAL importing and expand RAM banks w/ Level scripts.
And If you want proof, here, my hack.


First off, no need to get offensive now. No one is being cocky here and you shouldn't go over the red line. It won't get you anywhere but just into deep trouble. I have a very blah blah herpderp


Thanks for clearing that, Tarek. If your ROM is larger than 64MB, then it is a custom self-mod method, and you basically broke our warranty. Also, 114MB? How do you plan to use 50MB of extra space just for custom RAM banks? That's entirely unnecessary. You could fit 100 32x64 textures (or 100,000 vertices) in a 1MB expansion. The only thing bothering me (and probably Tarek) is that you said current ROM hacks, as you implied that they are 114MB by default. They're not. We've only had to go up to 64MB at the moment. So our normal hacks should be fine.
By current I mean new hacks, will keep my dictionary close to me next time, When I was helping Mario Crash with his hack Super Mario Temple Quest the hack was also 114MB and WarioMan21's Sonic hack too was also 114MB, new hacks being made are 114MB and sorry if you found my post offensive, it wasn't meant to sound like that.
Originally posted by Tarek701
Originally posted by Mr. GreenThunder

Don't say what you don't know man + still being cocky when you are wrong, current ROM hacks are now expanded to 114MB especially when you want to do AREAL importing and expand RAM banks w/ Level scripts.
And If you want proof, here, my hack.


First off, no need to get offensive now. No one is being cocky here and you shouldn't go over the red line. It won't get you anywhere but just into deep trouble.

To the beginners which E-mail spammed me after Cackletta's successful attempt of confusing anyone

Originally posted by Tarek701
Originally posted by Mr. GreenThunder

Don't say what you don't know man + still being cocky when you are wrong, current ROM hacks are now expanded to 114MB especially when you want to do AREAL importing and expand RAM banks w/ Level scripts.
And If you want proof, here, my hack.


First off, no need to get offensive now. No one is being cocky here and you shouldn't go over the red line. It won't get you anywhere but just into deep trouble.

To the beginners which E-mail spammed me after Cackletta's successful attempt of confusing anyone

Cackletta, please stop replying him, Tarek already knows what you mean and you can see where he is going with this, even I am not an expert in SM64 hacking but I still get what you mean, It's foolproof and you don't want what he did to Ugotballs to happen to you, we all know ROM hacks can be expanded to 114MB, why don't we just discuss why hacks don't work on ED? Thanks.
Originally posted by Wario man21

Cackletta, please stop replying him, Tarek already knows what you mean and you can see where he is going with this, even I am not an expert in SM64 hacking but I still get what you mean, It's foolproof and you don't want what he did to Ugotballs to happen to you, we all know ROM hacks can be expanded to 114MB, why don't we just discuss why hacks don't work on ED? Thanks.


Difference here just is, that UGotBalls pretty much deserved it, after he went rage-mode and spammed the whole forums. Cackletta hasn't did anything of this (yet). Seeing Cackletta ending like this isn't my goal as you irrationally believe.

To topic:
I think, the main issue for SM64 hacks not working on the ED64 is that the injected code(by the hacking software such like level importer, TT64, etc.) in the ROM seems to be poorly coded. Any accurate emulator, may it be MESS, MAME or the current cycle-accurate Cen64, will fail as you can't do unaligned read or write operations on the hardware. There are special opcodes which usually handle this, but the most people who code their hacking software didn't use it, because the most emulators seem to ignore it anyway and so many hackers oversee it. So it works fine on Emulators but turns out horribly on the N64 Hardware. So, it most likely isn't the fault of the ED64. It is the fault of the hacking software which produces code that works perfectly on a N64 Emulator, but not on a real N64 Hardware. If VL-Tone or many other hackers would've tested their hacking tools on a real N64 Hardware before, they eventually could've prevented it. There are also many things to consider such like that PI reads are aligned to 2 Byte Boundaries, where most use 4 byte to be absolutely safe, etc. etc. So in summary, emulators do ignore the alignment of data to increase the speed (Try out a real accurate N64 Emulator and you see that the most games are horribly slow). So if hackers test out their hacks on the emulator, they miss the unaligned data errors in the hack.

Messiaen(aka frauber) uploaded long ago a video once (when we asked him to try out his hack on a real N64 console) showing how his "missing stars" hack run on a real N64 console:
The Missing Stars Hacking Videos

The hack started fine, but there were many, many display, texture and vertices errors.

Originally posted by Mr.GreenThunder
By current I mean new hacks, will keep my dictionary close to me next time, When I was helping Mario Crash with his hack Super Mario Temple Quest the hack was also 114MB and WarioMan21's Sonic hack too was also 114MB, new hacks being made are 114MB and sorry if you found my post offensive, it wasn't meant to sound like that.


As I said, not significant enough to call this "default" already. By default each hack is expanded by 64MB. People can manually expand it any further if they want. My problem with you (to say it again) was just that you implied that every hack is expanded by 114MB by default, which isn't true. It's an "optional" thing someone can do for whatever reason. But obviously not mandatory. I don't really see any point to expand it by that far anyway but just wanted to point out that hacks are still expanded by 64MB by default when using the ROM with the level importer. (again: To solve the questions by the many who asked me) Also, I would recommend to not use PPF Patches for files >100MB. BPS Patches are very small patches, people don't have to extend+expand their ROM anymore and can simply apply the patch, turning their 8MB ROM instantly to the 114MB ROM.

Greetings,
Tarek701.

My Mail | My Posts | PM Me | My YT Channel | My Blog
Don't stop the argument, I and others are enjoying it, WarioMan worries too much, I have seen Mr G and Tarek talk to each other on the IRC before, I'm sure they are still buddies and why is he referred to as Cackletta?
Originally posted by PretzelKing111
Don't stop the argument, I and others are enjoying it, WarioMan worries too much, I have seen Mr G and Tarek talk to each other on the IRC before, I'm sure they are still buddies and why is he referred to as Cackletta?


His old name was "Cackletta" before. He changed it later. I still refer him to as "Cackletta" cause that was his original name he had when he first registered here.

EDIT:
Also, I never had any problem with Cackletta/Mr.GreenThunder. Sometimes people are just confused if they see stuff like "ROMs are expanded now by 114MB" which makes others believe that it is now a new "standard" that each ROM is now expanded by 114MB if used with the level importer, which is not true. By default (if you run your 24MB(extended) SM64 ROM on the Level Importer for the first time) the ROM is expanded to 64MB. Optionally you can expand your ROM even further (by hand or by some other tool), of course. But it isn't mandatory, as I said in my last reply already. There should be also some clear reasons for expanding it any further. If there's not really a reason, then you can keep it to 64MB. You can still make great hacks. Even Kaze, how did a lot of ASM Hacking to his ROM, made proper use of the 64MB and didn't even had to expand it any further.

My Mail | My Posts | PM Me | My YT Channel | My Blog
Originally posted by PretzelKing111
Don't stop the argument, I and others are enjoying it, WarioMan worries too much, I have seen Mr G and Tarek talk to each other on the IRC before, I'm sure they are still buddies and why is he referred to as Cackletta?

Why encourage the argument? We should all just get back on rack about which hacks work on everdrive 64. Further derailing could cause this thread to be trashed.
New layout by RanAS!
Originally posted by MilleniumLuigi
Originally posted by PretzelKing111
Don't stop the argument, I and others are enjoying it, WarioMan worries too much, I have seen Mr G and Tarek talk to each other on the IRC before, I'm sure they are still buddies and why is he referred to as Cackletta?

Why encourage the argument? We should all just get back on rack about which hacks work on everdrive 64. Further derailing could cause this thread to be trashed.


My thoughts were (which I wrote today already):
Originally posted by Tarek701
I think, the main issue for SM64 hacks not working on the ED64 is that the injected code(by the hacking software such like level importer, TT64, etc.) in the ROM seems to be poorly coded. Any accurate emulator, may it be MESS, MAME or the current cycle-accurate Cen64, will fail as you can't do unaligned read or write operations on the hardware. There are special opcodes which usually handle this, but the most people who code their hacking software didn't use it, because the most emulators seem to ignore it anyway and so many hackers oversee it. So it works fine on Emulators but turns out horribly on the N64 Hardware. So, it most likely isn't the fault of the ED64. It is the fault of the hacking software which produces code that works perfectly on a N64 Emulator, but not on a real N64 Hardware. If VL-Tone or many other hackers would've tested their hacking tools on a real N64 Hardware before, they eventually could've prevented it. There are also many things to consider such like that PI reads are aligned to 2 Byte Boundaries, where most use 4 byte to be absolutely safe, etc. etc. So in summary, emulators do ignore the alignment of data to increase the speed (Try out a real accurate N64 Emulator and you see that the most games are horribly slow). So if hackers test out their hacks on the emulator, they miss the unaligned data errors in the hack.


But I'm interested if there are other reasons for this.

My Mail | My Posts | PM Me | My YT Channel | My Blog
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