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[C] 3-1 - Autumn Jungle
Forum Index - Events - Collaboration Projects - SMWC Island - [C] 3-1 - Autumn Jungle
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Not so much to say now...
I completely redesigned the first area, now it is much better in my opinion
The difficulty has been significally lowered in the second room

Uninteresting but obligatory screenshots




>Download 1.1<

The 2nd area still lags in snes9x but not so much like before
So after playing the level, I don't think I want to play it again unless it has a major overhaul.

Here are some big/minor problems:

1. A minor problem at the start, Yoshi is inside the stake when entering the level. Also perhaps try to make the bottom of the pipe not cutoff like that. Plus just get rid of the koopa. Ambushing a player when they enter the level is not cool.



2. So why does this return pipe in the train room lead to halfway across the first area? Shouldn't it lead to the first pipe at the starting point?



3. In my opinion, you should move the green platform to the left a bit and add something like this before the koopa jump. It's too hard to time both the moving platform and the koopa's heights at the same time.
BEFORE

AFTER



Also at this point, you should add more horizontal tracks at the top so its easier to move back and forth to time the yellow platform.



4. Can you get rid of the Hedgehog that ambushes you when you try to get here? (I already ate it in the pic)



5. So I got ambushed by the off-screen green piranha when I tried to jump on the see-saw platform.



Another off-screen ambush by another green piranha plant right after the 1st middle ring.



6. So what's up with this arrow sign wanting me to go back? Found nothing new.



7. I reckon you should get rid of this piranha on the pipe. If the player runs out of eggs, it's only going to be an annoyance rather than an obstacle.



8. Get rid of the hedgehogs out of the 1st middle ring room.

9. So I found a hidden red coin in the water where the spitting fish is. At least put some normal coins there too to provide indication?



10. So in this side room, you have to jump across numbered platforms while gathering goodies from timed flyguys. The problem is that you gotta go backwards and there are too less of these platforms or they need to be numbered higher. Also the red coined flyguys stop too low I think.



11. Nothing here to indicate there's a bottomless pit. The petal shooting flower being at the edge of the cliff doesn't help at all.



12. How weird there's a second middle ring and then the goal is a few moments away.

So the main thing I felt throughout the level is the sheer amount of enemies just bunched up together. It seemed like you were trying to put enemies for every single bit of your level so the player would never have breathing room if they rushed to the end. It just feels like a big mess.

Even without rushing I felt there were too many enemies here to make the level enjoyable to get 100%. There are many more spots where the player gets ambushed that I didn't list up there. There are just too much.

There was a good amount of exploration and side areas throughout the level though. But again, the number of enemies doesn't make it enjoyable to try find or explore.

Overall, the level was not really fun for me at all. A few side rooms were cool but the majority of the level isn't good at all.
I was not expecting someone other than S.N.N. to play my level \o/

Update
>Download 1.2<

- Finally corrected starting point and middle rings!
- Slighty redesigned train bonus room
- Added more stars in 2nd area
- Removed one or two sprites in 2nd area... again
- Fixed almost everything pointed out by cramps-man


----------
Originally posted by cramps-man
1. A minor problem at the start, Yoshi is inside the stake when entering the level. Also perhaps try to make the bottom of the pipe not cutoff like that. Plus just get rid of the koopa. Ambushing a player when they enter the level is not cool.

- That's the default 3-1 starting position(fixed in the update, along with the middle rings)
- That was a debug pipe I forgot to remove #ab{:P}
- well I extended the skinny platform by 1-tile, now you have more time to react


Originally posted by cramps-man
3. In my opinion, you should move the green platform to the left a bit and add something like this before the koopa jump. It's too hard to time both the moving platform and the koopa's heights at the same time.

I will keep as is, you just need some good timing(note: I made the koopa jump easier now in the update)

Quote
Also at this point, you should add more horizontal tracks at the top so its easier to move back and forth to time the yellow platform.

Added in the update!



Originally posted by cramps-man
5. So I got ambushed by the off-screen green piranha when I tried to jump on the see-saw platform.

Fixed



Originally posted by cramps-man
6. So what's up with this arrow sign wanting me to go back? Found nothing new.

(If you mean the train bonus room, it was supposed to be there, not at the beginning)



Originally posted by cramps-man
7. I reckon you should get rid of this piranha on the pipe. If the player runs out of eggs, it's only going to be an annoyance rather than an obstacle.

Uumm... does this look familiar ??



Originally posted by cramps-man
8. Get rid of the hedgehogs out of the 1st middle ring room.

Once again, you have enough time to react, plus they are incredibly easy to avoid(Extended it by 1-tiles in the update)



Originally posted by cramps-man
10. So in this side room, you have to jump across numbered platforms while gathering goodies from timed flyguys. The problem is that you gotta go backwards and there are too less of these platforms or they need to be numbered higher. Also the red coined flyguys stop too low I think.

- It is meant to be like that, Just don't step in the 2-numbered platform twice and you're good!
- mmhhh... the last fly guy does stop too low, that was not intented. Fixed



Originally posted by cramps-man
11. Nothing here to indicate there's a bottomless pit. The petal shooting flower being at the edge of the cliff doesn't help at all.

Fixed


Originally posted by cramps-man
12. How weird there's a second middle ring and then the goal is a few moments away.

I don't know.... I placed it there just for the sake of having a mid-ring in the end of each area(also the bonus room at the end comes to mind, it is a little difficult just for being a bonus room?)
any ideas to where could be moved?

--------------------
- Yoshi's Island graphics enhanced patch
So first I guess I'll say that the fixes improved the level by some, but there could be more improvements to make it even more enjoyable. The train room is quite good now, and fixing the ambush points remove the unfairness.

I think that to make the overall level feel better you need to reduce the number of sprites even more than you have. There are quite a few enemies that feel like they've been just put there just to fill up the area. Instead of packing an area with stuff, try make it longer but spread out the contents.

In this case for your level so far, you could do this by removing some stuff from the 1st and 2nd areas, then extend the 3rd area a bit. Probably need to move some bonus rooms from the 2nd area to the 3rd just so the 3rd isn't lacking. It would solve the 2nd middle ring being too close to the goal, plus balance things out more.

Also try make the earlier areas more easier than the rest. Right now your 1st and 2nd areas feel around the same in difficulty so there doesn't feel like any progression.

Here are also some more problems to fix.

1. So in this area, there's a red coin flyguy that's supposed to appear. But sometimes he spawns too early when we are coming from the left side. Sometimes he also spawns very close to the edge of the screen so the player misses him. Perhaps you should move him to the right a bit, near the pink platform?



2. Before the 1st middle ring room, I found these by dropping down. Are these part of your level? If so then I have no idea how to collect them, as there are some red coins there.



3. For this bit, I'm not sure how to get to these wing clouds to access that pipe to the top right of this screen. Going under the rocks in the water didn't work so I'm not sure.



4. For these bonus rooms up here, perhaps you need to remove 1 and put it in the extended 3rd area. Also add more monkeys as if you screw up once, then it's impossible to get up there.




5. I think this spike here is quite unnecessary and quite a bit too much to deal with alongside the balloon bombs and the green piranha.



I think with a lot of work to overhaul the level somewhat, this level can be super great. But you still have lots more to go before it reaches that point.
updated
>Download 1.3<
- Removed a bunch of pointless/filler sprites
- Removed some green piranha plants because they were a bit overused
- Fixed a break in one of the bonus room + very small redesign


Originally posted by cramps-man
1. So in this area, there's a red coin flyguy that's supposed to appear. But sometimes he spawns too early when we are coming from the left side. Sometimes he also spawns very close to the edge of the screen so the player misses him. Perhaps you should move him to the right a bit, near the pink platform?

Extended the area



Originally posted by cramps-man
2. Before the 1st middle ring room, I found these by dropping down. Are these part of your level? If so then I have no idea how to collect them, as there are some red coins there.

I thought the coin pattern in the pipe was pretty obvious...



Originally posted by cramps-man
3. For this bit, I'm not sure how to get to these wing clouds to access that pipe to the top right of this screen. Going under the rocks in the water didn't work so I'm not sure.

Hint: stand on the palm tree below the egg block and move to the left, you should dive deep enough you can go under the rocks
There are other methods but the one I mentioned is the easiest




Originally posted by cramps-man
4. For these bonus rooms up here, perhaps you need to remove 1 and put it in the extended 3rd area. Also add more monkeys as if you screw up once, then it's impossible to get up there.

If you eat the monkeys you can use the evil flowers to jump higher, don't even complain about the monkey in the 1st screenshot because is far enough you will never eat it and throwing an egg is your fault



Originally posted by cramps-man
5. I think this spike here is quite unnecessary and quite a bit too much to deal with alongside the balloon bombs and the green piranha.

uuuhh... tha stake is pretty harmless and easy to avoid, the balloons and piranha are too far... BUT! I removed it anyways because they were overused


Late but I just realized how wrong this complain is. "Nothing here to indicate there's a bottomless pit", you move just a tiny bit to the right and you can see some ground, heck, even in your screenshot you can see some ground. Making it obvious that there IS a bottomless pit

--------------------
- Yoshi's Island graphics enhanced patch
This level is pretty hard, but I kinda had a fun time with it and enjoy some good ol' challenge, so many of cramps's complaints are not shared by me. I liked the koopa jumps. A couple spots did feel a bit unfair/frustrating like the longer pit with a hedgehog right on the other side (near impossible to dodge). I guess if we just want to keep the difficulty of this entire hack/game low (was that a requirement?), then I'd say knock it down another notch, but as its own level I like it.

One lag point I found:


--------------------
wiki
Version 1.4
Another version of the level, hoping this to be the final version
-The most important change here are the correctly spaced middle rings!
-once again moved/removed a few sprites
-Very small redesign in bonus room

Hopefully now this fixes the lags and ambushes, also there's important information inside the .zip before inserting the level into the rom base

--------------------
- Yoshi's Island graphics enhanced patch
I like the improvements, if anyone else has any critiques I'll give it a little bit of time before inserting.

Only thing I noticed was this:



The sprites when you walk on mud look weird in this room.

Just found another in this room: pipe entrance when coming in from top is off a bit.

--------------------
wiki
Originally posted by Raidenthequick
Only thing I noticed was this:
(img)
The sprites when you walk on mud look weird in this room.

Just found another in this room: pipe entrance when coming in from top is off a bit.

Fixed in the link below

Version 1.5
No changes list this time, the only changes was what Raidenthequick pointed out

--------------------
- Yoshi's Island graphics enhanced patch




What the fuck is going on here?



Is this chomp rock meant to do anything? It's impossible for me to push it anywhere, and all it really does is turn this monkey upside-down.

I was only able to find 3 flowers and 14 red coins. I assume most of what I missed is placed in hidden warps somewhere, in which case you might want to mark them better so I'm more curious about them, and add more things to jump on so I'm not fucked if I miss a jump.
Alright, played through this again. I was able to find everything but two red coins.

This level feels a tiny bit too hard. I feel like you could go ahead and remove a couple of those spray fish to ease up on the especially tricky areas.
>Waits for other people to comment
Come on guys!


By the way here's the new version 1.6

so what changes I have made this time, well...uuuhh I forgot about it since the last change I made was about one month, so let's say more sprite changes
Oh, and there's also a message box somewhere

--------------------
- Yoshi's Island graphics enhanced patch
I would've played the earlier version, but last time I checked the links were down.

Anyway, overall the level is okay, though I often felt like there were too many enemies around, and that can make some parts frustrating.


That also leads to some slowdown in these areas, especially the latter.


This room would've been cool if the train was actually needed. After getting past that ledge, I can easily get to the flower with just normal yoshi.

The other secrets/puzzles are fine though, I liked them.

e: I forgot to mention, but I'm missing like 5 red coins. I did the room with the green blocks, got the coins over the pit, did the diving secret, the shy guys and piranhas kill rooms, and the room with the platforms with numbers. (that's not all the coins, I just listed the secrets I remember).
I'm missing red coins as well. Can you please take a look at this and fix this issue? I feel like this level is close to done. Thanks.

--------------------
wiki
Originally posted by Lui37
That also leads to some slowdown in these areas, especially the latter.

Try using other emulator than snes9x and that area will be slowdown free. I used Bsnes/Higan and snesGT to test the level and had zero slowdowns


Originally posted by Lui37
This room would've been cool if the train was actually needed. After getting past that ledge, I can easily get to the flower with just normal yoshi.

Oh WOW... can't believe I missed that, fixed


By the way, version 1.7
-Yet more sprite placement changes
-Two red coins placement changes

--------------------
- Yoshi's Island graphics enhanced patch
Thank you sir, looks good. I'll call it done for now, but if anyone has any other comments, feel free to share and I'll take them into consideration for the final release.

--------------------
wiki
I played through this Level, and I got to say, it was really well done. There are only 2 Things I should bring up at this time...for yours and RaidentheQuick's Information.

When I played through this Level, there was a Serious Lack of Red Coins and Flowers. I only seen 1 Flower and it was a Trap Flower (The ones with the Mad Face on them).

The other thing I have to mention is that there was a lot of Enemies in the Level as a Whole. Maybe it was just the fact that I'm not Great at the game, but I had to use Savestates a Lot in this Level.

Nevertheless, I thought it was Creative. Very Nice Scenery. It looks Incredible. Nicely done doggycharly.
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