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VLDC9 Results - Judge comments added

A message box taking away L3 should not affect score at all honestly EXCEPT aesthetics. It could be counted as a bug, but it'll be fixed in the baserom (if one comes) with an ASM patch. My opinion, but yeah. I'm pretty sure something like this shouldn't actually effect the "design" part of it unless there is something I'm missing.
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If anyone is wondering which levels are DQ'd and won't be in the hack, here's what me and Jack discussed on IRC.

10:15 Falconpunch Hey Jack
10:15 Falconpunch Do you know of which levels will not be put in the hack? (aka which ones are DQ'd altogether)
10:17 Jack most likely
10:23 *** Eevee joined #vldc
10:23 *** AFKeon quit (Killed (NickServ (GHOST command used by Eevee)))
10:23 Jack aaaaand, of course, there are also some people who exported their entire map16
10:23 *** Eevee is now known as AFKeon
10:32 Falconpunch i see
10:32 Falconpunch I believe these five are subject to disqualification...
10:33 Falconpunch What NOT to do (MARIOWORLD), Level 01 (jshaaa), Mysterious Ice Cavern (Minakami), Systrem Studio's level, and Mushroom Inferno (nahuelscoba)
10:33 Falconpunch Which ones are to be DQ'd?
10:38 Jack wow... spot on :P Though you forgot J.T.W.

So, rounding it all up...

-(Level) - J.T.W.
-(Level) - Systrem Studios
-Mysterious Ice Cavern - Minikami
-Mushroom Inferno - nahuelscoba
-Level 01 - jshaaa
-What NOT To Do - M A R I O W O R L D

These six levels are disqualified and will not be put in the final project. It's gotta be a lot of work to put stuff in the worst this year, due to all the penalties and such...
I have nothing else to say now. Huh...
Not looking forward to seeing Lazy's level in the worst world.

As for opinions, subjective, objective, etc., I get it. I've seen teachers grade essays before. But sometimes when your opinion varies by more than double or half the "norm", or points are just docked off categories other than design for levels being too hard, that is adding insult to injury... You can have your own opinion but if your judging has multiple outliers, comments are imperative so that authors will know what they have been doing wrong. I get also that judging 110+ levels is difficult and maybe the previous level made a judge "burnt out", so to speak, for the next level. This I think is even more of a factor than anonymous judging. Mood from previous levels or a hard day at work all affect judging probably. Just look at raocow's JUMP LP and how he played ever since Depraved Stronghold.

About anonymous judging--I bet if ninjaboy knew who designed Mass Extinction, he would have given more points wink wink. But it doesn't affect most people. Also, some judges wrote in their comments about Frost's third hostel around, so the anonymous judging aspect didn't really help there. I still think anonymous judging should be applied because it is a minor source of bias.
Originally posted by ft029
Not looking forward to seeing Lazy's level in the worst world.

Matterhorn? But it's not even slightly there
(btw I'm eager to see if he has any comments on his level, it's a rather interesting... thing)

As a judge I really loved the anon system. As I told several people already, opening a ROM with nothing but a number in the filename makes you pretty much expect anything rather than create a prejudgement of it for the author's name, which may affect the judging. Doing it that way was super fun, but having to keep myself from leaks was a bit annoying. All for its cost, I guess.
Considering that a few of you didnt keep information about your level to yourselves when a few of you made non-privatized YT vids early on in this contest, its enough of a reason to say that anonymous judging should not be used again for the next VLDC. Bias risks notwithstanding (which is nearly impossible to eliminate in the first place), as I'm very sure that past vldcs before did one had those judges look at the levels as objectively as possible without the anonymity system (if im wrong about this information, correct me please).
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-I also do not accept speculative work as I do have various art I made on-hand with me.
-I am more receptive to equivalent exchange of resources in which case, you can DM me wherever I have an active presence on for the details.
-Other times I'm availible for your project is C3 request threads I may run.




I don't really like the anonymous level idea. All it did was make levels harder to share and the people who scored high in the past still scored high this time.
I think we should keep the anonymous judging system, and maybe even expand it to other contests. It prevents scores from being altered because contestant x is judge y's buddy etc. There might be leaks here and there, but if a judge ends up looking for them, well, that person doesn't deserve to be a judge.

I'm happy with my score btw! Tying with 2 other people is my new record. I liked the fact that pretty much the same problems were brought up by the judges, now I know what to change for next year. I don't mind if my level got mixed opinions, if for someone it was a weird level in a good way, and if for someone else, it was just a flat level with swapped enemy faces. The judges were different, had different tastes and thus we got different scores. Now maybe some judges were better than others, maybe some of them need to improve or to be replaced, idk.
My Level, Frozen Mirage, did NOT get last place? Really? My Level Sucks, though. Not getting last place is very Surprising to say the least, and is an Honour in itself haha. Despite it getting 98th Place, I'm glad that the Judges (Sort of) Enjoyed it.

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I should have something witty to put here (even if it's just to update dated info), shouldn't I?

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Quote
I think we should keep the anonymous judging system, and maybe even expanding it to other contests. It prevents scores from being altered because contestant x is judge y's buddy etc. There might be leaks here and there, but if a judge ends up looking for them, well, that person doesn't deserve to be a judge.



Any judge worth their weight should be able to put aside how they feel away about an person to fairly judge their entry. If you cannot do that, then you should not be trusted with judging anything.

Originally posted by MrDeePay
Giving out the max score possible doesn't necessarily mean a level is perfect.

Okay since when is a perfect score not an indication of "perfect"?
I'm in favor of keeping anonymous judging. I think it was handed pretty well by the staff (I talked to Koopster before he finished his judging and he only knew the name of two entries). I'm sure our judges are doing their best to put aside any bias they might have towards the author, but not knowing who the author is in the first place is the best way to avoid bias, and if this system worked so well I don't see why we shouldn't use it again.
Keep anonymous judging.

Aside from that, there's gotta be a way to get rid of those ties. I guess no one was expecting a 100 entries, but next year just make the total out of a 100 just to make ties less scarcer. It's a little silly to think that any of these levels are equal, tbh.

Originally posted by Nimono
At the same time, you have to accept that some people just have different opinions than you. No level is perfect, but that doesn't mean I can't give a perfect score. Nor does you not liking them mean I can't find them great.

Oh don't go <Nimono> Opinions on me. I've repeatedly said that this year's "out of wack" scores aren't as bad as any of the past years, and I made clear, or at least tried to, what my opinions are. The only thing I said was objective was Wakana's level being not 60/60 considering the many messy problems with it. You asked and wanted me to explain more about what is "out of wack" (again, poor wording compared to ninjaboy's) about your scores and I explained. Don't put words in my mouth about Opinions when all I did was explain myself.
I am also in favour of keeping anonymous judging as it does remove any possible bias but I feel like the judges should get the final say on whether or not it is used in the future.

As for the ties yeah I doubt any levels are of equal goodness but it makes sense why they would happen. Also What are they doing for the ties anyways?
Why the judges? It's not like it'll be the same people next year.
I'm definitely in favor of anonymous judging. Sure, it may be a bit harder on the judges' end as far as avoiding spoilers is concerned, but it still feels like it adds a layer of excitement to it. #smw{;)}
I really need a layout. :<
Well, at least I'm glad the judges didn't disqualify a contestant for exposing his or herself and instead, giving a few point reductions.

So, I guess I'm supporting anonymous judging too #tb{:j}
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I'd say scrap it. I did not like having to log in each I wanted to check this section for new entries & posts.
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Hi.
Originally posted by Frost
Why the judges? It's not like it'll be the same people next year.


Well I thought since they had to do it they should know if they felt it made a difference to their judging or if it was just an annoyance. Also side note do you think you will do judging next time?

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Originally posted by Frost
Originally posted by MrDeePay
Giving out the max score possible doesn't necessarily mean a level is perfect.

Okay since when is a perfect score not an indication of "perfect"?


Why waste your time having a number scale if you're not going to consider using the entire range if necessary? A max score basically means that the flaws are so insignificant that they're not worth deducting any points over. Look past the surface.

Originally posted by Najeraldo
I'm in favor of keeping anonymous judging. I think it was handed pretty well by the staff (I talked to Koopster before he finished his judging and he only knew the name of two entries). I'm sure our judges are doing their best to put aside any bias they might have towards the author, but not knowing who the author is in the first place is the best way to avoid bias, and if this system worked so well I don't see why we shouldn't use it again.


Any judge worth their weight should be able to put aside how they feel about a person to judge their entry as fairly as possible. It's otherwise a waste of time and resources anyway.

Are you upset/afraid that someone better than you in a contest performed better than you? Then why don't you, oh I don't know, improve your work so much that you end up being better than them?

Originally posted by Frost
Keep anonymous judging.

Aside from that, there's gotta be a way to get rid of those ties. I guess no one was expecting a 100 entries, but next year just make the total out of a 100 just to make ties less scarcer. It's a little silly to think that any of these levels are equal, tbh.


Unless you're giving out actual tangible prizes for placing and not virtual trophies, then you should not care about a tie in this or that place beyond a certain point (usually Top 5).

I'd be fine without anonymous judging if players are not allowed to talk directly to judges about their levels. There's probably a proper term for that but I'm gonna say that's a "conflict of interest". I was writhing in pain watching nimono dies lots in my level because he was rushing, but I don't think it'd been right for me tell him to stop rushing.

Although I admit that I did tell nimono that certain levels (I think it was either morsel's or lazy's) were gonna take up a lot of time when he was streaming it.

Originally posted by nathanrayman1998
Also side note do you think you will do judging next time?

I want to but it's up to whoever's in charge. I've made my tastes and views clear, hopefully. Though I'd probably a very critical judge.