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american election thread
Forum Index - Donut Plains - General Discussion - american election thread
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Well, I wish I could apologize on behalf of the entire country to the rest of the world, but...I didn't vote for the jerk, so I'm not sure what I could have done differently. I can certainly see now where all the negative American stereotypes came from, though, and frankly, I'm starting to agree with them. Just remember that not all of us are bigoted morons.
Originally posted by Tarek701
Disagree. We'll be patient and wait how it turns out before we judge, sir. :)

We don't need to wait, a lot of his policies are stuffs that have been attempted in the past, with devastating result for certain minorities (stop and frisk ended up mostly targeting blacks, "gay cure" therapy never worked and only caused psychological damage, islamophobia only help disenfranchising muslims which help ISIS recruitement, repealing obamacare will result in what used to be the status quo for the poors where medical bills could easily lead to bankruptcy).
hope my queer / disabled / minority friends are holding strong. the best that they can, at least.

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Personally I'm hoping the dude's incompetent enough that we pretty much have the status quo. Status quo is bad, no doubt, but it could be worse. I don't want him to be too incompetent though, since sufficiently advanced incompetence is indistinguishable from malice.


Things I want, that likely aren't to happen under Trump (note: some wouldn't of happened under clinton either):
- Reduction of wealth gap between rich and poor.
- Moving closer to free healthcare.
- Protection of minorities' rights and freedom from harassment.
- Protection of women's rights and freedom from harassment.
- Protection of worker's rights.
- Reduction of the NSA and other useless and harmful intelligence agencies.
- Less abysmally bad immigration policies. Ones that actually let brown and poor people into the country.
- More/better regulation of banks and businesses.
- Movement toward green energy.
- Environmentalism in general, particularly positive climate change policies.
- Complete overhaul of copyright/IP law.


If any of you conservatives want to convince me you don't have a black heart of ice, then convince me that at least some of the above will be supported by our new establishment that you voted for. (and since I probably have to say it twice, "clinton wouldn't of either!" isn't a good response)
pence is a big fan of conversion & shock therapy for queer folks, and the republican platform this time around is the most queerphobic one they've had in decades, so GLHF my fellow friends

when's he planning to build this great wall of america

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the difference between Democratic and Republican manner of rule is that Republicans might have different ideals, but they are in favor of a small government. This means that where Democrats would regulate or restrict/force laws onto people. Republicans would just refuse to regulate and let society decide for themselves.

Some people simply believe citizens don't need to be infantilized by the government.


I'm actually reluctant to talk about the election at all. Since, as has been shown in this thread, people are extremely quick to consider you an outcast for having a different political position. I'm actually not in favor with a lot of shit Trump says. He's too radical, but the reason I defend him is because he isn't the devil, and people who genuinely support him aren't demons either.

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Our human rights are not about political positions, if you vote against them then of course we're gonna dislike you for it.
Politically I don't think you're that bad (considering you've said many times you don't support Trump), but I think you're missing the point that people "jumped" on you for that post earlier because you literally were being human trash telling someone suicidal that they're faking it for attention or for political gain.

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Your layout has been removed.
I only jump on you Torchkas because you act so smug and highly quite a lot of the time. I've tried debating with you but it is incredibly frustrating.

Calling out Leomon like that was just awful and shows a significant lack of empathy.

This video shows why America is currently about to be fucked.
Originally posted by Ladida
Originally posted by Wavee
if you supported trump or brexit you are factually trash and are ruining this world

#tb{:(}

Is this acceptable.
Originally posted by Torchkas
people who genuinely support him aren't demons either.

This I'll agree with. People are people, and people are fallible. There are a lot of decent people who only voted for him because he's a republican, not because they actually support anything he advocates. The truth of modern politics is most people care more about tribal affiliation than anything else.


As for Trump himself... well, he is pretty despicable. A modern day robber baron. Hella sexist. Hella racist. If we're going to judge people on anything as far as morals and ethics go, those are some of the worst things to be.
@lolyoshi : This thread is going to be full of salt, it's a political, openminded thread (At least I would like to think of it that way). In a way, the above isn't an insult; it's generalized and more like an open opinion, and therefore is allowed.
Originally posted by Torchkas
the difference between Democratic and Republican manner of rule is that Republicans might have different ideals, but they are in favor of a small government. This means that where Democrats would regulate or restrict/force laws onto people. Republicans would just refuse to regulate and let society decide for themselves.

Some people simply believe citizens don't need to be infantilized by the government.


As far as infantilization, I'd argue both sides do it in equal manner. Both parties have their moral guardians that want to get deep into your personal life and force you to live your life their way.

As for regulation and big government though. The government needs to be big enough to serve its people, and needs to regulate for that reason too. Separating regulations and laws makes one sound bureaucratic and unnecessary, and the other just the foundation of society. But regulations are just as important as laws and just as integral to making it work. You could argue for near-anarchy and total non-regulation if you want, but while you may be able to keep the peace through local systems (which likely would not be as fair), you have literally no protection from people or groups who hold huge amounts of power. If the government was small enough, one of the super rich in the world could hire a mercenary army and enslave your entire town, and you wouldn't be able to defend yourself. In other words, we'd be back to a medieval system of life.

Hundreds of years ago we all learned we could be strong enough as a collective to hold our ground against private power. We've fought for that a lot of times. Small Government undermines freedom as much as a totalitarian government, because the government's power is the only collective power we have. Without it, we would be at the mercy of private power instead, and constantly being shafted by them.

And, to be fair, the current donor situation in the USA means that a lot of the government's power IS in the hands of private groups instead of the public. We have a similar but different problem, with the house of lords baked into our government which is a quite frankly horrible and undemocratic system.

(Closing statement: I would rather pay more taxes and know that I'll get good heathcare, and that my kids will get good education, than pay less taxes and be at the whims of people who care about personal profit and not the public.)
Lobbying affects both parties though. The universal healthcare system you have right now is awful, Trump didn't argue for the complete removal of a healthcare system, he said that it shouldn't be a government monopoly but should allow healthcare providers to compete for price and quality of life. That system would be similar to what we have over here, which works perfectly if you ask me.
Republicans don't argue for complete anarchy. They argue that equal opportunity doesn't mean equal outcome. They argue that leveraging people who don't get the same outcome as others is unfair.

Infantilization in the republican party happens more on the evangelical side, which Pence probably is, but Trump definitely isn't. The Democrats however, currently have a minority of people who really believe in the free market, whereas that used to be different.

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Trump is not perfect, but atleast hillary didn't win which means no war which means peace for europeans.

As for the homosexuals, I don't think Trump is gonna change anything. Even if he outlaws gay marriage, that doesn't stop you from loving the person you love, does it?

I feel like many people here don't have any tolerance for any other ideas than their own. I think that's is the real shame.

To the person who said right-wingers don't want to collaborate or make compromises: https://youtu.be/owuq_An4cnk?t=1m13s

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key element: its not about the identity but the movement.

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Originally posted by Jesse
As for the homosexuals, I don't think Trump is gonna change anything. Even if he outlaws gay marriage, that doesn't stop you from loving the person you love, does it?

i cant believe i had to read this sentence with my own 2 eyes.

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Originally posted by Jesse
As for the homosexuals, I don't think Trump is gonna change anything. Even if he outlaws gay marriage, that doesn't stop you from loving the person you love, does it?

I feel like many people here don't have any tolerance for any other ideas than their own. I think that's is the real shame.

That is both so ironic that I'm dying and so sad to see that people actually think this.
It doesn't stop you from loving, but it stops you from accessing any of the many benefits of marriage.
Love doesn't feed your family, let you visit each other in the hospital or give you tax cuts.

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Your layout has been removed.
Marriage is made for the family. So people stay together and raise their kids in a stable environment.

Personally I think its a bad choice to outlaw gay marriage. Homosexuals too should set a proper example on how to do a relationship

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It is unfortunate, then, that the people in power now disagree with you and will push their strict, religion enforced view of marriage on the United States and will prevent gay people from taking advantage of a wide range of legal advantages that come with marriage.
Originally posted by Jesse
Marriage is made for the family. So people stay together and raise their kids in a stable environment.

Okay? How is that relevant to anything said?
Adoption and surrogates exist and gay couples including a trans person can have kids.

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Your layout has been removed.
The way I feel is that this whole election will go down in history as one of the worst of all time. It will truly be hard to top this. Neither of the candidates from the big two parties were the right fit for our needs, and there is simply too much hostility between the people because of it. The way I look at it is as a storm, you just have to hunker down, wait it out and eventually it will clear up. The fact of the matter is we are where we are because of events that the right people couldn't change, and it is impossible to go against the almighty dollar. Flinging shit at one another and gloating or putting words in other peoples' mouths doesn't help anyone. The only thing I'm mainly disappointed about is that more of my fellow Americans didn't vote third party, at least if we had a few more votes, we could have had some real potential change in the next election.

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Pepper your angus.
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Forum Index - Donut Plains - General Discussion - american election thread

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