Originally posted by AnasMario130
With big features such as the tall horizontal level and custom layer 3 tide features in LM3, isn't it about time we should finally edit all the Mode 7 boss levels within LM itself?
Like, I know there's already a tool
to edit Iggy/Larry's rotating platform, but there's no way to easily edit the layout of the other M7 boss levels, such as Bowser's or Ludwig's. This would make the original bosses much more interesting to fight within the creatively edited arenas. In fact, you could extend the dimensions of the M7 arenas whichever way you want!
The original M7 bosses are a little lame to fight over and over again in hacks, even with small changes such as a bullet bill generator. And if you try to put any sprite such as a flying hammer bro in Ludwig's or Morton's arena, for instance, a sprite wall that usually blocks one side of the screen in Morton/Roy's arena will just block the player at spawn, making the whole thing unplayable (though that could be fixed if someone makes a patch for it).
But... by being able to diversely edit the M7 arenas, we can spruce up the battle a lot!
This has lots of potential, you know! What do you think?
I'm not exactly sure what it is you think you'd be editing in LM with those... I have a feeling you're not entirely aware of the limitations the game is dealing with in those mode 7 boss levels.
Keep in mind that when you use mode 7, you get exactly 1 layer and the sprites. Nothing else. And if you're doing fancy rotations on the boss, that effectively means the mode 7 layer IS the boss, which is why a lot of the rest of the level's layout has to rely on sprite (OAM) tiles.
The game can of course cheat a bit by using IRQs to switch screen modes at certain vertical positions. Take Ludwig's fight for example. For lines 0-38, the game is in mode 1 which allows you to have the status bar and the bricks at the top. Then it switches to mode 7. The boss is using that layer, so everything else here must use sprite tiles. Then when you reach line 176, you're back to mode 1 so you can have the floor and lava.
There are consequences for that kind of setup. It means Ludwig cannot be displayed in that upper or lower region. He's literally trapped in that mode 7 area of the screen. You want to put a block in there with him? Maybe change that background? Well that has to all use sprite/OAM tiles, cause he's using the mode 7 layer just to display himself.
This is why the status bar is gone in Bowser's fight. For that one the entire layout is displayed with sprite tiles, so Bowser is free to fly everywhere.
Originally posted by Deeke
Interesting! Explains why I could never take advantage of them myself back when I didn't know what I was doing.
Hopefully one day we can add these kinds of hardcoded paths in the editor without needing any external hacks, even though it's probably a huge pain.
Well if you know how they work you can at least take advantage of the existing ones. Since most of them are by level number instead of by position, you can even move the pair of levels to a different place and the hardcoded path will "move" with them without having to edit the tables. You just need to keep the 2 levels at the same relative position to one another. Potentially useful if you need a path to cross over a normal one.