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Making C3 more fair
Forum Index - Valley of Bowser - Site Questions, Feedback & Bugs - Making C3 more fair
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I think that all posts on the C3 should be anonimous during the C3 and after the votes, all names are revealed, Doing this people that doesn't have a lot of famous can recieve more atention, also things like remove Views and Comments counter during the C3 can make that people see more unpopular posts.

Usually during C3, the most of the prizes are only recieved by popular people from smwc, also the most of the post recieve only 1 or 2 comments and very few views.

Not like it's hard to tell who did what just by looking at a thread's title, especially if we're talking about those "popular people" you want to derail the attention from.
One thing that always slightly annoyed me is that threads with 'haha funny' titles seemed to grab more attention than the more serious ones. It's not to the point that those get ignored, no, yet to me they comparetively fall behind a little.

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  • It will always be the case that a minority of threads gets the majority of posts.

  • There are more low-effort threads because they take less effort to make. Same for the number of replies: silly threads get more replies because it's easier to make a silly reply than a serious one (lamentable as that may or may not be).

  • Most of the time you can easily tell who's who anyway. People who have a well-known hack or style will be recognized, people who post videos can be identified on Youtube, and people who show off resources they submit to SMWC can be identified on the submission page.

  • Even if it weren't easy to tell who's who, C3 would turn into a guessing game, and lots of posts would just be theories on "who made what".

  • Even with anonymous submission, it still comes down to how well you can advertise. A well-written post that knows how to present its content will attract more attention than a lackluster one.

  • Are you excited for E3 because you never know what you're gonna get, or are you excited for Nintendo's presentation?

To make C3 anonymous we'd have to change the way it works fundamentally, and in the process - I think - take away all the fun.

 

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What is decided now? Is C3 public or anonymized?
Originally posted by OP
Usually during C3, the most of the prizes are only recieved by popular people from smwc, also the most of the post recieve only 1 or 2 comments and very few views.

Has there ever been a trophy for most undernoticed? It'd be good for peeps who show fabulous things that deserve more attention than they even get. All the threads with a bunch of posts shouldn't win the category.

As for unnoticed threads, those with very few posts should be prioritized until they get a decent amount of them. This would make the event fairer as less common threads would get more attention in favor of threads with majority of posts. Just saying cuz ropeboxes aren't enough to attract attention to anything deserving more of it.

Also, I think mods should be more careful for invaluable content. Only part of it goes to Trash Can, actually.
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Originally posted by Emerald Shell
Has there ever been a trophy for most undernoticed?

There was for Most Overlooked actually.

What are the benefits of an anonymous C3 anyway?
Originally posted by Katerpie
Originally posted by Emerald Shell
Has there ever been a trophy for most undernoticed?

There was for Most Overlooked actually.

What are the benefits of an anonymous C3 anyway?


Most of the time people enter to a post for 3 reasons, the op name, the number of views and the number of comments, without those 3 things, each post should have more chance of don’t be ignored, usually a few number of posts (5 or less) get the 90% of all views and comments, I know that there are a lot of posts with 0 effort, but there are others that have a lot of effort and nobody check them, for that I am suggesting ideas to do C3 more fair for the most of users.

I don’t know if my start suggestion are the best, but at least I want to open a discussion about it to find solutions.

Have you considered that the threads that gain the most replies and views are popular for a reason? I don't see a way to force users to give equal attention to all threads. You'll have threads that stand out above others for a number of reasons.
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I don't really care that much about the contest aspect of C3 anyway, I just like seeing all the stuff that people make.
Mecha-Porky #69 mechanically dabbed!
Thread for hack I might not finish due to poor time management
Originally posted by Giftshaven
Have you considered that the threads that gain the most replies and views are popular for a reason? I don't see a way to force users to give equal attention to all threads. You'll have threads that stand out above others for a number of reasons.


Sometimes the popularity of a thread is because the post is good, but in a lot of cases is only for memes, shitposting or people that is famous on the website. Also there are a lot of people that do excelent threads but receive almost nothing of attention because the people ignore their threads because they are not popular.

Originally posted by anonimzwx
Sometimes the popularity of a thread is because the post is good, but in a lot of cases is only for memes, shitposting or people that is famous on the website. Also there are a lot of people that do excelent threads but receive almost nothing of attention because the people ignore their threads because they are not popular.

Like other people said, this will always be recurring no matter what. It's a matter of how the threads stand out from the rest.
I pretty much agree with you that threads made solely for the sake of memes shouldn't take the spot of the more underrated threads, but all it takes for them to get noticed is to advertise them properly.
"Huh, I wonder who this anonymous user who made this thread called '100 Rooms of Enemies: The Nightmare Edition' for the 5th time is? Who could ever possibly make such a thread?"

Mellonpizza


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Originally posted by Katerpie
It's a matter of how the threads stand out from the rest.

Non-SMWC hacking and non-hacking always stands out from the rest as long as there's some effort put into them, but they often don't get as much attention as they deserve.
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Originally posted by Emerald Shell
Originally posted by Katerpie
It's a matter of how the threads stand out from the rest.

Non-SMWC hacking and non-hacking always stands out from the rest as long as there's some effort put into them, but they often don't get as much attention as they deserve.

Which goes back to what we're saying about how well you advertise them.
I honestly don't see a point in making C3 anonimous. If anything it'd destroy a C3's entire purpose. C3 exists to give everyone an equal opportunity for impressions and feedback on their stuff (i think). Of course something like request threads are kind of a black sheep in that regard.

In a nutshell about what threads get more posts though: Threads that encourage more input from others, what means every thread that is not simply just showing off a thing you made, will of course get more posts in them because of their very nature. That is why request threads are so popular, because they solely rely on the interaction from others.

Originally posted by anonimzwx
Usually during C3, the most of the prizes are only recieved by popular people from smwc, also the most of the post recieve only 1 or 2 comments and very few views.

A really big counter argument to this is one or two C3's ago when a lurker showed off a really nice ASM patch (iirc it was about yoshi's colors or something?) and that thread really got a lot of traction even though noone knew how they were before that. Of course a user's "fame" will always affect the posting quantity a bit but it's not impossible for someone less known to get attention if they deserve it.
To be clear though, I'm not excusing shitpost threads. Unless there is anything in them that deems them worthy a part of the C3 Convention I think staff should get a bit more strict on moderating threads with no worthy content in them. Here I have two examples of what i think good shitpost c3 threads are. I won't go out of my way to look for a bad one for the sake of not potentially calling anyone out for anything.

Anonimous submissions could be something for a potential tourney or something of that nature. A solution I would have for making C3 more "fair" would be adding more trophies for underlooked content. Maybe branch out the "most underlooked" into "most underlooked hack/hacking resource/non-smw item" or something like that.

In all honesty though there should never be any sense of contest or competition during C3 or anything creative ever unless it is a contest or tourney like VLDC.
// Layout by Maxo
somewhat unrelated but i said this sometime last c3: request threads should be banned

they require zero prior effort. in a way, they are cheating, because you have absolutely nothing prepared for c3; all the content is created afterward (and overflows over the following weeks). yet they get the most posts because they abuse the fact that people are needy and want free things. i just dont think they are in the spirit of c3, which is to show off cool stuff. all you're really doing by making a request thread is advertising yourself

no offense to people who made request threads in the past; just stating what needs to be stated
Is this problem of things that deserve attention not getting it really relevant anymore, or is it just a given by now to bring this topic up every single time? I haven't seen this problem in any of the recent C3's I've participated, and I always make sure to check bottom of the page threads to see what's up down there.

I remember this problem being a little more evident back in 2012-2013 with things like SuperFX and your own DynamicZ not being so hugely recognised despite the huge amount of work put into them, but even that can kind of be boiled down to their unfriendly presentation to the general public. In general, people want things they can use. I would say DynamicZ is very well known today.

fake e: relatively, quick reply threads get more attention for obvious reasons, and while it is a valid "solution" to ban them, we really need to put the "problem" in perspective. How much do these threads actually bother creators? Will banning quick threads make other threads get more replies, or will it just make C3 partially die out?
I don't see the point in this suggestion. Hiding everything is not necessarily easy from a technical standpoint; posts would have to be anonymized past simply removing name/avatar/layout, the discord bot dealt with (what happens when there's a public post with no known author), posts made restricted within profiles, etc.

And I highly doubt anonymity would even work the way you want it to. Everybody will know who made the popular projects anyway. I wonder who made the Sicari 2 demo, or the cool SA-1 showcase? The art style in this request thread looks awfully familiar...



Re: Request threads - Do these threads really *take time* away from other threads? Most posts in these threads are quick requests, in and out, and generally few people comment on requests made for other people. The time spent in these threads for anyone but the OP is marginal at best.

Regarding creation of content during and after C3, I find it curious that people only complain about this in reference to request threads. Nobody seems to care about other content that was clearly made during the event and not before. A notable example is mice, which was initially a thread with nothing in it made at the last minute before thread creation closed, but wasn't edited with the hack until nearly the end of the event.
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Regarding request threads: I don't think they should be banned at all. Everything that's creative is allowed and who said that the author of a request thread cannot be creative at all? They can add smth the others didn't think about when they requested a drawing or smth. Draw thread authors can have a creative style, e.g. realistic or polygonal. Request threads can have unusual subject, i.e. not be related to art, music, or ASM which is also creative.

Originally posted by Katerpie
Originally posted by Emerald Shell
Originally posted by Katerpie
It's a matter of how the threads stand out from the rest.

Non-SMWC hacking and non-hacking always stands out from the rest as long as there's some effort put into them, but they often don't get as much attention as they deserve.

Which goes back to what we're saying about how well you advertise them.
I hadn't got a reply on my idea to make attention more equal, but thanks to the further discussion, I realized it was bad. Also, thanks for answering my question. I'm forgetful and my memory of last C3's trophies is bad. I could also find the answer to my question on my own, but I was too lazy to do that.
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